The Brief

On a warm October morning in 2021, three men and one woman met in a squat, unassuming building in a working-class neighborhood in the middle of Los Angeles.

They were four of the most powerful people in the city: Ron Herrera, the head of a prominent union group, and three L.A. city council members: Gil Cedillo, Kevin de León and then-council president Nury Martinez. They didn’t know it at the time, but everything they were saying was being secretly recorded.

For the next 90 minutes, the four Latino leaders would speak candidly using demeaning and racist terms about colleagues on the council, Black political power, indigenous people and even a child — all within the context of a meeting held to strategize how to advance Latino power in the city.

A year later, on Oct. 9, 2022, that recording was leaked to the public.

When the media began publishing excerpts from the tape, they shook Los Angeles to its core. It led to protests outside — and inside — City Hall and at the homes of the people on the tape. There were calls for resignation from fellow council members, national politicians, and even the president of the United States.

Now, in her first interview since the scandal broke, we pressed former L.A. City Council President Nury Martinez about the racist and offensive things she said.

We also asked Martinez to engage and think through how her comments were connected to the larger systemic issues of anti-Black racism and colorism in the Latino community. Over the course of our six-hour interview, Martinez largely declined to do so.

“I don't even know if I'm the right person to even have these conversations anymore,” she said in Episode 2, “because I've been tainted in such a way where I don't even know if I would even be welcome. Even in this conversation, I feel really scared and nervous to even dive into that.”

She also discussed her experience of the scandal and how it has affected her mental health.

Antonia Cereijido and Martinez spoke over the course of two days at LAist’s Pasadena studio. The conversation below has been condensed and edited for clarity.

Listen to more in LAist Studios’ Imperfect Paradise podcast. The series includes interviews with those who were most impacted by the hurtful comments on the tape including former L.A. city councilmember Mike Bonin, current councilmembers Marqueece Harris-Dawson, Eunisses Hernandez and Nithya Raman, indigenous human rights organizer Odilia Romero, and Professor Tanya Hernández, who has written about anti-Blackness in the Latinx community.

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Host Antonia Cereijido presses former L.A. City Council President Nury Martinez to account for the racist, hurtful comments she made on the secret recording that rocked Los Angeles and led to her resignation. CONTENT WARNING: Sensitive subject matter.

Nury & The Secret Tapes: Part 3

Host Antonia Cereijido presses former L.A. City Council President Nury Martinez to account for the racist, hurtful comments she made on the secret recording that rocked Los Angeles and led to her resignation. CONTENT WARNING: Sensitive subject matter.

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Learning about the tapes, and the decision to resign

Antonia Cereijido: Let's talk about the day when the tapes were published. When did you hear about the tapes and their existence?

Nury Martinez: I was having coffee with my husband at our kitchen table, and it's about 9 or 9:30 a.m. when I get a phone call. My then-chief of staff, Alexis Wesson, calls me and says, “there is a tape.”

And her exact words were, “Do you remember wearing Doc Martens to a meeting?”

[Note: One of the first things Martinez says on the tape is that she’s wearing Doc Martens].

I go, “Doc Martens? Like the shoes? I have Doc Martens, but I don't know what you're talking about.”

She goes, “Someone found tapes of you where apparently you're at some meeting and you're wearing Doc Martens because you mentioned Doc Martens in the meeting.” And I was like, ‘I have no idea what you're talking about.’”

By 8:30 or 9:30 a.m. the next day, which was now Oct. 9, there's a story in the L.A. Times, and now by this time I'm getting phone calls from folks asking me what this is about. By that time it's now clear to me that the meeting they're talking about is the Oct. 18, 2021 meeting that the four of us held at the County Federation of Labor. And now it's like, who taped this? Who could have done this?

By that Sunday, the protesting had begun. I had people at my front door on my driveway shouting just absolute obscenities into my child's bedroom, calling me the C word. “You, you racist C word, you effing B word. We're gonna kill you, you should die.” It was all happening really, really fast.

Protestors demonstrate outside City Hall calling for the resignations of L.A. City Council members Kevin de Leon and Gil Cedillo in the wake of a leaked audio recording on Oct. 12, 2022.

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I had already internally, even though I did not say this to anyone, I had already accepted that this was so big that there is nothing that I could say or do to undo this and that I needed to step down. A hundred percent. I knew that there was gonna be consequences, that I needed to pay for this.

On Joe Biden, Karen Bass and Alex Padilla

Over the next 48 hours, dozens of elected officials called for the resignations of Martinez, Cedillo and de León, including U.S. Senator Alex Padilla and former Congressmember Karen Bass, who was, at the time, running for mayor of L.A. Martinez had recently endorsed Bass for mayor, and she was close with Padilla and his family; they went to the same high school in San Fernando, and Padilla’s brother, Ackley Padilla, was her former chief of staff.

On Oct. 11, 2022, President Biden’s press secretary, Karine Jean-Pierre, said during a press conference, “the president is glad to see that one of the participants in that conversation has resigned. But they all should. He believes that they all should resign. The language that was used and tolerated during that conversation was unacceptable and it was appalling. They should all step down.”

NM: During the first 24 hours of the tapes being leaked, Karen Bass did reach out to me and we talked several times. She was very supportive. And at one point I said, “if you have to renounce my endorsement, I will completely understand.” She didn't think we needed to do that the first 24 hours.

And she actually thought that somehow this would settle down or blow over in about one or two days. And we were actually expecting President Biden in Los Angeles that Thursday, and I was supposed to have a fundraiser, a Latino fundraiser for her that Saturday as well. When I talked to her on the phone, I'm like, “What do we do about President Biden's visit? Do I not show up? Like, what do you want me to do?” She's like, “No, we're moving forward. You show up.” And, you know, thinking this was gonna blow over.

I wanted to believe her, but I think deep down in my heart, I'm like, there is no way that this is gonna blow over. She also reached out to Ron Herrera for a possible press conference with the two of us. And then that didn't go anywhere. She was discouraged by a group of ministers, I think. But the intent of her standing with us was there. And I appreciate it.

Bass called me afterwards and she said, did you see Senator Alex Padilla's statement? I said, “No.” She goes, “It's bad.”

Alex never shared his statement with me. We did have a conversation. In fact, I was curled up in the bathroom when I took Alex's phone call, like at seven in the morning [on Monday], and he was really hard on me. And I was trying to explain what had happened and I wasn't getting through. And all I kept saying is, “But you know me.” And I might've said, “I don't know if I can withstand this, I'm scared.” And I didn't hear anything back.

U.S. Senator Alex Padilla. (Justin Sullivan/Getty Images)

And soon after that, the cries for resignation were so loud. I then got on the phone with [L.A. city councilmember] Paul Krekorian and told him that I was gonna step down as council president.

AC: What strikes me about how you're describing those couple of days is that it sounds like you were sort of in “logistics brain.” But in terms of sitting down and thinking about why people were upset about the tapes, or processing, was that going through your mind?

NM: Oh yeah. That went through my mind, at night 'cause I wasn't sleeping. And so the first thing I attempted to do is take full responsibility and apologize, which I know was not accepted at the time, and then fix what I had done. Of course, I thought about what this has done. Of course I thought about Mike's baby. Of course. But once phone calls kept coming in, I didn't necessarily feel comfortable with these people on the phone. I didn't know if I was being recorded. I didn't know if they were talking to the press. So I didn't talk about these things with anybody on the phone. The only thing I knew how to do is hand over my responsibilities as a council president and make sure that I didn't mess up anything else.

AC: How did it feel to hear that President Biden had weighed in?

NM: I was in shock. I wanna believe that he had to do it because he was coming into Los Angeles on that Thursday. Maybe he just wanted to get it out of the way. That's what I thought.

Senator Padilla told us he does not dispute Nury’s account of this call. LAist reached out repeatedly to Mayor Bass, described this story to her spokesperson and asked for her comment, but we never heard back. In a later interview with LAist’s Larry Mantle, Bass denied she thought it would blow over, and added, “even if it was, I wanna take a crisis and seize it as an opportunity.”

Redistricting and Black political power

In another part of the tape, the four Latino leaders discuss redistricting, the once in a decade process of drawing new city council district lines. 

They focus on Council District 9, a majority Latino district in South L.A. that’s currently represented by a Black man, Curren Price. They care about this district because it’s become the district with the highest percentage of Latino residents in the city, and they think it will be represented by a Latino in the future. They want District 9 to have some good economic “assets,” like universities, stadiums, airports, etc, that are tied to good union jobs and bring resources into the district.  And they’re concerned the redistricting commission might take some of those “assets” away.

In particular, the four people in the room wanted the University of Southern California – USC – to remain in Council District 9. But that would mean leaving Council District 8, which is also right next door to USC in South LA, with very few economic assets. 

District 8 has the highest percentage of Black residents in the city. On the tape, Martinez proposed that Marqueece Harris-Dawson, who represents Council District 8 take LAX from his “brother,” Mike Bonin, whose district included the airport. Some people interpreted this as the four Latino leaders scheming to keep resources out of the hands of the Black community. 

AC: For me, listening to the tapes, just the fact that you do hear redistricting talked about in these racialized terms and it does sound like there's a zero sum. Like, “us Latinos get this, Black people get this.” I think it was shocking for the average person to hear that. I wanna give you the opportunity to respond to that.

NM: That wasn't the intent, and I think … of course, it's shocking. It makes people angry.

I think the Latino community, particularly that the Latino leaders in Los Angeles, have been incredibly cognizant about not starting a war over these seats, that eventually these seats will flip and they will turn Latino because that's what they're trending. But we as leaders in Los Angeles have never engaged in trying to, for example, run a Latino candidate against an African American candidate. I don't remember the time that I've been on the city council that I have not supported an African American colleague or an African American friend who happens to be running for that seat. And so that is, I think the misperception about why we were in that room is that there is this false narrative that we were meeting to dilute or take away political power from the African American community. And that's simply not true.

AC: Do you think Black people have disproportionate political power in Los Angeles and do you think it's come at the expense of Latinos?

NM: Not necessarily. I think the Latinos need to work on unifying our community. I don't think we have to blame anybody else. I think it's up to us to get people to turn out to vote.

AC: One thing that comes through in the tapes is that there's sort of a positioning of like, it's like white liberals in L.A. are allied with Black progressives and like Latinos seem left out. Do you think that's an accurate–

NM: You know what, I don't, I don't know if that was an accurate description of it.

I will tell you that the conversation and other conversations we've had as Latinos is, Latinos are becoming more and more invisible.

And that is something that I saw not only in the media, but I see in politics. I see in everyday life. When you turn on the television, our stories are not being told. And when we do tell them and when we are frustrated, even in a private conversation, it's turned against us. Like we don't have a right as a community to advocate for ourselves because somehow that goes against another ethnic group. I don't know why we do that.

AC: The way the Latino and Black community were talked about was like a zero sum game. Like there's a Latino seat and there's a Black seat, and that would negate Afro-Latinos as a community. I don't know if when you say Latinos, if you think of the Afro-Latino community.

NM: No, I can't say I do, but it's not on purpose. ‘Cause Afro-Latinos, particularly in Los Angeles ... I think you see more Afro-Latinos in Florida and New York and DC.

On L.A. District Attorney George Gascón

On the tape, Martinez disparages L.A. district attorney George Gascón, saying, “F*** that guy. I'm telling you now, he's with the Blacks.” Gascón was elected in 2020 on a platform of criminal justice reform and ending mass incarceration in the city. 

L.A. district attorney George Gascón,

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AC: You said, “Gascón, he's with the Blacks.” What does that mean?

NM: You know, I walked in there really angry and frustrated and it was, it was a mean and insensitive thing to say, and I didn't mean anything by it.

The conversation that we were having didn't have to do with Gascón himself, just had to do with so much of the frustration and anger that I was carrying with me inside me when I walked into that room. And that is no fault of the African American community.

It's just everything that was going on during COVID, with me as council president, the lack of support for what we were trying to do on the council, the amount of personal attacks against me, my leadership and my family were taking a toll on me. And that was it. There is absolutely no excuse for us. I think I let my anger and my frustration get the best of me, and that was it.

AC: There was no policy issue that you –

NM: No. I have absolutely no relationship with him whatsoever.

Racist comments about former Councilmember Mike Bonin's son

On the tape, Martinez told a story about being on a float during L.A.’s Martin Luther King Jr. Day Parade in 2017 with a number of elected officials and their family members, including Karen Bass, Karrie Harris-Dawson, who is married to councilmember Marqueece Harris-Dawson, former city councilmember Mike Bonin and his son, Jacob, who was then a toddler. According to Martinez, the women were discussing Jacob’s behavior on the float. In recounting the story during the meeting that was secretly recorded, Martinez described Jacob, who is Black, by saying, “parece changuito,” which means, “he seems like a little monkey.” 

Martinez and the other leaders on the tape also described how Bonin would bring Jacob to city council and other events during Black History Month, which Kevin de León compared to Martinez bringing her designer handbags to council meetings. Herrera suggested the child was a prop and a statue on a plantation, and Martinez compared him to an accessory. Martinez later said, “Ahí trae su negrito, like on the side,” which means, “there he brings his little Black one.” 

AC: What did you mean when you said, about Mike Bonin’s son, “parece changuito”?

NM: The way I grew up with that word, “parece changuito." It has nothing to do with skin color. It has more to do with behavior. You're sort of just playing around. You're horsing around. Another word that we use in Spanish, “es travieso” [mischievous], you can’t stay put.

It's a conversation I should not have repeated. And I think that's an example of a bunch of moms sitting around you know, being critical of little boys' behavior. That was my mistake.

It was insensitive. It was mean. I never meant to hurt Jacob, and I'm going to have to live with that for the rest of my life, you know? I've never romanticized motherhood. Anybody who knows me and has been around me knows my child is also pretty wild. And now she's a teenager and it's even crazier at a different level. I've never romanticized parenthood. It's really, really hard. And I've been around those moms who sometimes we're critical of other children and we kind of talk smack about with one another. We're moms, right? I never meant to hurt Jacob. I thought about this a hundred times of what I would say to him if I would see him.

Former councilmember Mike Bonin photographed in his home.

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AC: What would you say?

NM: I would hug him. [I would say,] “I never meant to hurt you baby. That was never my intent. It was a conversation I had with four women that I should not have repeated.”

AC: Had you used that particular word [changuito] to describe children before?

NM: Yes, in my family, yes. In fact, my mother said that to me. It was common when I was growing up, and my mom actually pointed that out to me when the tapes broke. She said we used that word at home. [I told her] my mistake was that I was referencing an African American baby and I shouldn't have done that.

AC:  Why do you think it's different to say it about a Black kid versus a kid of another race?

NM: I did not mean it in a derogatory way, and it wasn't meant to describe him as a Black child. That was not the intent of the word.

AC: But do you understand why is it that that word specifically is offensive when talked about a Black kid versus another kid?

NM: Oh, a hundred percent.

AC: No, just the why –

NM: The word was not meant to be derogatory, and I was not describing him in that way because he is a Black child. I was simply referring to his behavior and that was it.

AC: Mike Bonin and [councilmember] Marqueece Harris-Dawson told me that the way you were talking about Jacob on the float is what a lot of people do to Black boys, treating him like he's older, like he has more agency or responsibility than he really does. What do you think about that characterization?

Councilmember Marqueece Harris-Dawson photographed near USC.

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NM: No, I think it was just moms just being critical of you know, a rowdy kid. Just like they would’ve been of my own kid. That was just us being moms.

AC: Would you have used that word in English?

NM: Never. Never have I ever used those words in English. I think in Spanish, then I speak in English. And so my vocabulary comes from me being an English learner. And I think for me, those words are not meant to hurt anybody, or to sound racist at all. I think it's just words that I grew up with.

Racist comments about Oaxacans

The four leaders discussed Koreatown, a neighborhood in Los Angeles that has a large Indigenous Mexican population. On the tape, Herrera says, “my mom used to call them indios.” 

Martinez says, “I see a lot of little short dark people,” and, “I don’t know where these people are from, like I don’t know what village they came out of, how they got here, but, tán [short for están] feos!,” which means, “they’re ugly.”

Protesters dance outside City Hall while calling for the resignations of L.A. City Council members Kevin de Leon and Gil Cedillo in the wake of a leaked audio recording on Oct. 12, 2022 in Los Angeles.

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AC: So the next part of the tapes I want to talk about is actually the part that, knowing your personal and political history, I was most surprised to hear, and that was your comments about Oaxacans. What did you mean when you called them ‘tan feos’?

NM: Oh my goodness. That's another thing that I will never forgive myself for. That was just a horrible, insensitive thing to say. I certainly don't have anything against the Oaxacan community. I feel horrible for having insulted the community.

AC: Do you think there's a colorism problem in Latino communities?

NM: Yes. Yes. I think there is. I think we're getting better and certainly my comments didn't help.

AC: So you, you don't think though, that you harbor a bias against people with darker skin?

NM: No way.

Anti-Black bias in the Latino/x community

AC:, I'm curious, looking back, why do you think you said that? Where was it coming from? Have you thought about why you said what you said?

NM: I've thought about that particular day, God, a thousand times, if not more. I was so frustrated. It's so angry and so alone and so abandoned by, by just, by everyone, particularly other members. And I think that over the two and a half years that I was council president, I just grew more frustrated and angry and pissed off at everything. And that's what you saw. That's it.

AC:  I understand the frustration, but I think there's like a difference between being frustrated and saying things that are insensitive, like you said. And so what I'm trying to do with this interview is unpack where the things were coming from. Because I think that there are a lot of internal biases that we as Latinos hold in the community that people picked up on, and they wanted to use it as an example to talk about this larger conversation about race. Do you think there's an anti-Blackness problem in the Latino community?

NM: I don't know. I mean, that's a really good question. I never felt we had one, um, on the council. Just speaking personally. My personal experience, that's all I can speak to.

AC: Do you think that there is a conversation to be had about anti-Blackness in the Latino community?

NM: Not in my household. Those conversations, um, have never, we've never had to have those conversations 'cause we've never felt that way. And that's just me personally. I don't know about other households or what else is happening in other communities, but I certainly have never felt that.

AC: One of the things that did happen was this larger conversation about how we talk about race in our communities and in many ways I think that part of it is good, like that we have to try more to have–

NM: You know, I wish I could dive more into that, because what this has caused for me is I don't even know if I'm the right person to even have these conversations anymore. 'Cause I've been tainted in such a way where I don't even know if I would even be welcome on a panel or in a group conversation to really dive into these issues, to figure out how we really feel about this. Because of what, how I've been perceived and characterized, that I could even in this conversation — I'm very worried, um, and feel really scared and nervous to even dive into that, if that makes any sense.

I'm not avoiding your question, but I'm just really scared to answer it. What if I say the wrong thing and now we're back to square one? I do not know if today I'm the right person to have those conversations. Do I believe they need to be had? Yes. I'm just being honest. I just don't know how to answer that.

The tape leak

In California, secretly recording a private conversation is a crime. The LAPD is investigating who recorded the meeting. Over the summer, Los Angeles Magazine and the L.A. Times reported that the police were investigating a former employee of the LA County Federation of Labor and his wife, who also worked there. The LAPD declined to comment or provide LAist with an update into the investigation.

In October 2022, a Reddit user named Honest-Finding-1581 posted nine pieces of audio – portions of various conversations that were secretly recorded in the L.A. County Federation of Labor a year or so earlier, which is how journalists discovered the tapes.

NM: I have always felt that as a Latina, I have never really been given a fair shake by the media. The coverage of these tapes in and of itself, says it all. I think there was a deliberate concerted effort to take snippets of the conversation and put them out to the general public. I have not found anyone who said to me, “I actually listened to the entire thing to get some context about what was taking place.”

AC: So you think if it had been presented whole, it wouldn't have blown up in the same way?

NM: Yeah, I do. [NOTE: The LA Times posted the full audio on YouTube within a week of publishing their first article about the tapes, and later published an annotated transcript of the full conversation.]

AC:  So what I hear you saying is that you feel like this is something that happened to you, not something you did.

NM: No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying, this is a conversation that took place in a private setting out of frustration and anger for whatever, everything that was going on. And I take full responsibility for it. And there's nothing that I'm ever gonna be able to do to express how horrible I feel about it. That's what I'm saying.

On Kevin de León

Kevin de León speaks to council member Paul Krekorian on Oct. 12, 2022, during the first L.A. city council meeting after the media began reporting on the secret tapes.

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AC: What do you think about Kevin de León's decision not to resign?

NM: I think it was the right decision for him. Kevin didn't commit a crime. I think we can count how many members on the city council have been indicted to date for really troubling corruption charges. But Kevin did not commit a crime, and Kevin is not a racist.

The effect of the tape scandal on her life

NM: If it wasn't for my mom, I wouldn't even be alive. There were so many times during the first three months of what had happened where I didn't get out of bed. And I remember my mom was so scared that I would hurt myself, that she would call me every hour on the hour.

She couldn't come over 'cause there were so many cameras. And I was so ashamed that I have — I still can't talk about those horrible, dark, dark days. I would go to sleep and, I remember this, I don't wanna wake up tomorrow.

And then I would have visions of my mom burying me. And I just couldn't, I just couldn't do it. I couldn't see my mom burying me. I am not at all suggesting that all should be forgotten. Absolutely not. I think these conversations need to be had. Um, but the sense of not being worthy enough to be forgiven or to be listened to was so hard.

People make mistakes. I would hope that after this people would find a different way to hold people accountable. Um, I hope you do it differently. I don't want this to happen to anybody.

AC: What is a typical day like for you now?

NM: I see my daughter off to school and make breakfast, have a cup of coffee with my husband, talk about the day. He's also not working. So we're constantly trying to figure out what our finances are gonna look like the next month, which has been really, really hard.

On the really, really difficult days, I'll just go to church. My mom, to get me out of the house, told me, “You need to go to church and you need to go ask God to forgive you. Man isn't gonna forgive you. God is. You own up to everything you said and what you meant, and that's all you can do.”

When I would have these dark thoughts, I would get so scared that I just would jump in my car and go to church, and oftentimes I would sit there by myself and just cry. For hours. I would come home around dinner time, and I would start making dinner or lunch for my daughter after she got home from school. And that would be my day.

I journal just to get some of these things off my chest, to remind myself that I'm still a good person even though I didn't hear it at the time. That I'm worthy. That I did a lot of good work, that I helped a lot of people, that I loved my career, my job. It was my passion. And that this too shall pass. I don't know what's next, but I do believe this too shall pass. But, I just gotta just be honest. What this has done to me and my family has completely destroyed us. I don't know what's next. I know that this took my passion and my light. I don't know how to describe it in any other way besides, I'm lost.

Rebecca Katz contributed to this story.

The First United Methodist Church has been in its ornate home in Pasadena for 101 years. For about 10 years, it has also been the home of a satellite location of the Islamic Center of Southern California, a large mosque in the downtown area. And for a little over a year, the Pasadena Jewish Temple and Center has also used space at the Colorado Boulevard church. The congregation lost their worship space to the Eaton Fire in January 2025.

That means that First United Methodist Church in Pasadena is today the site of bar mitzvahs and Shabbat services, iftar meals and Friday prayers and Christian Holy Week services.

Sometimes, within hours of each other.

“I'm not aware of any other church in the country that has all three Abrahamic faiths worshiping under one roof. It's pretty phenomenal,” said Pastor Amy Aitken of the First United Methodist Church.

The three congregations are using the church at a time when religion is an inescapable fact in conflicts around the world. Global tensions in Israel, the Palestinian territories and Iran are hitting close to home for communities with ties to the region. And in America, President Donald Trump is in a war of words with an unlikely combatant: the pope.

Pastor Amy Aitken sees First United Methodist as "an island of hope and grace in the middle of a world that is really divided."

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But Aitken views First United Methodist as “an island of hope and grace in the middle of a world that is really divided.”

“We're offering a place for people to gather, to worship, to connect, to be in community with one another,” Aitken said. “We don't have to agree on everything, and we come from different worldviews, and that's OK.”

I recently attended Friday prayers, Shabbat and Easter Sunday service at First United Methodist — and found quite a bit more common ground than you might expect.

Friday, April 3: Assalamu Alaykum

12:30 p.m.

People are streaming into a church hall on the First United Methodist campus through a side entrance.

Rizwan Bhatti, a doctor and volunteer who helps manage the mosque’s partnership with the church, pulls out colorful woven mats from a supply closet and lays them on the gray carpeted floor.

Two large wooden crosses hang on the wall at the front of the room, but the orientation is about to change. As people take their places and lay out their thick prayer mats, they face the back of the room — east, toward Mecca.

Muslim women listen to the Friday Jummah sermon in a church hall at First United Methodist in Pasadena.

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“ Honestly, it's the second best place that you could pray in,” Farah Bhatti said about the church hall, “because there's a spiritual feeling here, no matter what faith it originates from.”

Aitken said the previous pastor at the church had lived in the Palestinian territories for about 10 years and had deep ties to the Muslim community. When Rizwan Bhatti, who was connected with some of the parishioners, asked if the church had space for the Muslims to worship on Fridays, the pastor was determined to make it happen.

Mohamad Saleh Kholaki and Rizwan Bhatti.

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Mohamad Saleh Kholaki, a dentist who also serves as the khatib or imam on some Fridays, said the congregation is “lucky enough to have this location.”

“It serves a lot of community members that live around this area and their businesses around this area instead of going to the downtown,” he said.

And he said, the congregations haven’t had to compromise any aspects of their faiths. Kholaki said the Muslim congregation acknowledges Methodist Christian celebrations and that in turn is also reciprocated.

1:15 p.m.

After the call to prayer, Kholaki begins his sermon. Being Muslim, he says, is all-encompassing.

 ”If we deal with others when they show us some aggression with kindness and we smile and wave it off, I think we'll be in a better shape,” he says.

“ The act of transformation of discipline from Islamic teachings into regular life is the key word here,” Kholaki continues. “We have to transform ourselves from the time where we are on the rug to pray into regular life, to transfer that attitude to public.”

Muslim Jummah prayers at Pasadena's First United Methodist Church.

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After the sermon, the congregation faces Mecca and turns to the left and right. “Assalamualaikum warahmatullah,” they say — may the peace of God be with you.

Then, the worshipers neatly fold their mats and clear the space.

In two days’ time, tables will be set out in this hall for an Easter lunch.

5 p.m.

The church parking lot looks very different on Friday evening compared with this afternoon. Gone are the people with hijabs and fezzes.

Now, staffers from the Pasadena Jewish Temple and Center pin kippahs to their heads and help transform a chapel at First United Methodist into a temporary Jewish prayer space.

Kippahs are ready for worshipers.

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They wheel a wooden ark from a storage room through the church’s courtyard, passing the Fellowship Hall where Muslims prayed earlier, into the chapel. A cross on a stand is put away. The organ is pushed to a corner.

The ark is then set up in the front of the chapel and prayer scrolls laid out. Soft dark blue fabric lines the ark, and it is opened during specific times of the service. A table is set up for the rabbi and cantor. Members of the band are setting up their instruments and sound system.

7 p.m.

Hanging above the altar, an ornate lamp emits a red glow. The light in the chapel is called the perpetual light: For the Methodist congregation, it signifies God's everlasting presence with us.

It reminds Lawrence Harris, a member of the congregation of the ner tamid, or eternal light, which is found in all synagogues.

 ”When you walk into any synagogue, there's the feeling of the light of God,” Harris said. “And it's wonderful that they have here in the church the same symbolic light, whether it's the same God, it's just practiced slightly differently.”

The Pasadena Jewish Temple and Center's ark is placed under the chapel's perpetual light.

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Using the church as a temporary home for the temple, Harris said, has allowed him to reflect on the connections between Christianity and Judaism. And it has forced this congregation out of their cocoons.

This reporting trip has forced me out of my cocoon too. I am Muslim and wear a hijab. I’m also a radio reporter, carrying bulky recording equipment, a phone for pictures and backup sound and a notebook. Out of respect for Jewish practice, I put the tools of my trade away and become an observer.

That allows me to really listen and understand the prayers being sung. The rabbi and cantor begin by praising and thanking God. Then they ask for blessings for children and safety in this world. And because it is Passover, Rabbi Josh Ratner recounts the story of the Exodus, how Moses led the Israelites through the Red Sea to the promised land.

The echoes with that afternoon’s prayers praising God and asking for guidance are clear.

8:30 p.m. 

When the service ends, the rabbi and cantor lead the congregation into a small room, which years ago served as the Muslim prayer space, for a simple Passover observance with matzo crackers and grape juice.

And as the congregation begins to clear out, staffers restart the dance to put the ark, prayer books and tables back in storage. The cross is returned to its place and the chapel transforms back into a Christian worship space.

Saturday, April 4: Shabbat Shalom

6:30 p.m.

How do you know when Shabbat is over?

Some say it’s when you see three stars in the sky. Others say it can be planets and stars.

I chuckle a little inside: It’s a similar predicament for Muslims determining the end of Ramadan — some rely on calculations; others say you have to see the new moon.

Emily Catalano, assistant director of youth engagement and education, leads worshipers in Havdalah to mark the end of Shabbat.

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Yusra Farzan

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As the sky darkens on Saturday evening at a private ceremony at a home in Arcadia, the congregants of the Pasadena Jewish Temple and Center gather in a circle, link arms and sing “Blessed are You, God, our Lord, King of the universe, Creator of the fruit of the vine.”

With the sabbath over, Stacey Miller, a member of the congregation, reflects on practicing Judaism in a Christian church.

 ”What I find so easy about going to a church, though I still call it my temple, is that the Jesus that is up at this beautiful First United Methodist church in Pasadena is very abstract,” she said. “I don't feel like I'm looking at Jesus the Savior while I'm doing all my prayers with Moses.”

The stained glass windows of the chapel.

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The group of about 20 then settle in front of a projector to watch The Prince of Egypt, armed guards keeping watch outside.

That’s the reality of being Jewish in America right now, said Stuart Miller, a physician and Stacey Miller’s husband.

“ We call it a Jewish tax because we have an added expense of security,” he said.

Rising antisemitism has led local chapters of the Jewish Federation to partner to offer security at temples and other community spaces across Southern California.

The presence of armed guards at First United Methodist was unnerving at first, said Aitken, the Methodist pastor. It also helped teach empathy, she said.

 ”It's been a sobering teaching moment for our congregation as well to kind of see that,” she said.

Sunday, April 5: The peace of Christ be with you

9:30 a.m. 

The main sanctuary at First United Methodist is bathed in colorful light from huge stained glass windows. I watch from the balcony as parishioners come in wearing soft pastels on Christianity’s most important day. They are celebrating Easter after observing the solemn Maundy Thursday, which marks the Last Supper, and Good Friday, commemorating the crucifixion of Jesus Christ.

Worshipers takes their seats before Easter Sunday service at First United Methodist.

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Aitken said I was welcome to use my recording equipment and phone, but wanting to immerse myself again, I place it all on the pew.

The hymn “Christ the Lord is Risen Today” echoes through the church, and the joy people feel after the solemn week is palpable.

“The peace of Christ be with you,” they say, hugging.

In her sermon, Aitken draws out the similarities between Christ’s resurrection and the message of Passover.

The Exodus, she says, “is a story of liberation, and it is, of course, the story that is at the crux of Judaism — the sense that God comes, that God redeems, that God sees suffering, injustice and despair, and God intervenes to bring people freedom.”

Similarly with Easter — the celebration of Jesus’ resurrection after his crucifixion and death.

“ No matter how dark the tombs of despair and sorrow are in the world, we follow a Risen Christ, one who comes to bring into the world a new story, a story of a world transformed by the power of love.”

Stained glass windows depicting the life of Christ at Pasadena's First United Methodist Church.

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Yusra Farzan

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10:30 a.m.

As I sit in the pew reflecting on the weekend, I think back to Kholaki’s sermon at Friday Jummah prayers — about transforming ourselves not just “on this rug to pray,” but also out in the world.

Cantor Ruth Berman Harris of the Pasadena Jewish Temple and Center had the same thought.

 ”For Judaism I am very concerned with finding a path, a bridge between what we do when we are at synagogue and what we do when we leave the synagogue,” she told LAist in an interview.

Rabbi Josh Ratner added,  ”How do we make it so it's not just empty words that we're saying, but for words to live by?”

Aitken and her congregation see welcoming their Muslim and Jewish neighbors as living their faith.

“ We don't view this as anything heroic,” she said. “We are blessed with incredible buildings and beautiful sacred spaces. We are grateful to be able to use them in ways that I don't think our founders quite imagined, but that are perfectly fitting with the way the church understands its mission now.”

The jacaranda trees are blooming (a little early); the three-acre rose garden at The Huntington is in full bloom too; and Jazz at LACMA is about to start …

It's springtime in Southern California!

That also means it’s time to do a little planning for your next Southern California museum visit — so you can not only see some art, but also enjoy a free live music performance.

Music in the Rose Garden at The Huntington

The Huntington Rose Garden

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The Huntington

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The Huntington’s Music in the Rose Garden live music performance series is already underway. The series is in partnership with the Pasadena Conservatory of Music, and now is a great time to go and see the more than 1,300 varieties of roses in full bloom in the San Marino garden that dates back to 1908.

On Monday afternoons from 1 to 3 p.m. (through June 8) a different Pasadena Conservatory performer or duo plays instruments including piano, violin, accordion, cello and guitar.

Music in the Rose Garden performances are free, with paid admission to The Huntington or an annual membership. The series also returns in the fall.

An insider tip, especially for those visiting with kids (who get free admission if they’re under 4-years-old): keep an eye out for the rose garden’s fairy door.

Jazz at LACMA

Jazz at LACMA

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Photo courtesy of LACMA

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via Facebook

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The 35th season of Jazz at LACMA kicks off on Friday, May 1 and runs through October. The first performance this year is by vocalist and composer Michelle Coltrane, the daughter of jazz legends John and Alice Coltrane, as part of a celebration of the 100th anniversary of her father’s birth.

The live performances take place from 6 to 8 p.m. in the Smidt Welcome Plaza, next to the Instagram-famous “Urban Light” installation of 200+ antique street lamps.

The free jazz nights at LACMA don’t require admission to the museum, but if you do also want to visit the museum, admission is free for L.A. County residents from 3 to 6 p.m. on weekdays (including Friday).

If you’re looking to check out LACMA’s newly unveiled David Geffen museum galleries, you’ll need to be a member to enter on May 1. The next Friday opportunity for non-members is May 8.

Off the 405 concerts at The Getty

Off the 405 Concert: Woods

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Photo by Cassia Davis. © 2024 J. Paul Getty Trust

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The Getty Center’s nighttime Off the 405 summer concert series kicks off on Saturday, May 30 with a performance by blues poet, vocalist and composer aja monet. Other artists in the series include South Korean pop band and electronic musician Laurel Halo.

The “Off the 405” performance series is free, but does require an online reservation. Reservations for the aja monet performance will be available beginning May 7 and about three weeks ahead of each of the following performances (which run through August 22).

Also, admission to the Getty Center is free, but there is a fee ($15-25) for parking before 6 p.m. on Saturdays.

Golden Hour: Music in the Garden at the Norton Simon Museum

Norton Simon Museum’s annual Garden Party

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Norton Simon Museum

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The Norton Simon Museum in Pasadena offers free live music in its newly renovated sculpture garden on select Fridays from 4:30 to 6:30 p.m., beginning this year May 26 and running through August.

The performances are programmed by bassist and composer Masatoshi Sato and feature a range of musical styles. They’re free with admission to the Norton Simon Museum, which is $20 for adults and free for students and people 18 and under. Admission is free for all on the first Friday of every month from 4 to 7 p.m.

This story first appeared on The LA Local.

After widespread reports last year of immigration agents interfering with patient care and privacy at local hospitals, Los Angeles County now has a policy that asserts the rights of detained patients and instructs county public hospital staff on how to handle the ICE agents that accompany them. 

The policy, which went into effect in March, clarifies that patients brought in by civil law enforcement officers, including immigration agents, have the right to communicate with family members, legal counsel and advocates. Implemented by the LA County Department of Health Services, the policy has been described as a “new gold standard of care” meant to safeguard patient rights as hospitals navigate an influx of federal immigration raids.

There’s one problem, though: Hardly anyone knows about it. 

To physicians and advocates with the People’s Care Collective, a network of health care workers and organizers, this policy marks a major shift in how hospitals handle patients in immigration custody. But they said awareness of it has been lacking within the health care system, even though the Department of Health Services said the policy has been shared with staff. 

“The vast majority of the [LA County Department of Health Services] workforce, which is the second largest health care system in the country — second only to NYC — is unaware of this policy, unaware of all of the rights of their patients under this policy, and how the policy empowers health care workers to protect these rights,” said a Department of Health Services physician who is a member of the People’s Care Collective. The doctor asked to speak anonymously due to fear of retaliation.

The policy follows a Los Angeles County Board of Supervisors directive requiring the Department of Health Services to develop guidelines allowing patients detained by immigration authorities to authorize the release of information to family, counsel and government representatives. 

The policy also:

• Instructs staff to ask agents to remain outside of a patient’s room at all times, absent safety concerns
• Forbids unnecessary restraints, or shackling, of patients
• Requires agents to remain in public areas of the hospital unless they have a judicial warrant
• Requires agents to “remain identifiable at all times”
• Prohibits agents from acting as interpreters or surrogate decision-makers for detained patients
• Instructs staff not to physically interfere with ICE agents or assist a patient in hiding or fleeing
• Prohibits discharging the patient back into immigration custody “until custody is confirmed as lawful and documented.”

You can read the full policy here. 

These new guidelines only apply to public health care facilities and not private hospitals such as Adventist White Memorial in Boyle Heights, where doctors last year reported ICE agents violating the privacy rights of detained patients and prohibiting contact with patients’ family members. 

This article was published in collaboration with LAist.

People’s Care Collective members say they hope private health care facilities adopt similar measures — and they may have to if the state legislature passes several bills making their way through the legislature. But first, the members say, an education campaign is crucial to inform hospital workers and the public at large about the new guidelines.

“Being upfront about this really can set the precedent for places across the country to follow suit,” the LA County Department of Health Services physician said. “It’s our patients’ rights to know these rights. If we really care as a county that wants to live by our values [of caring] about all of its residents, including immigrant residents and folks who are being targeted by ICE, we need to walk the walk.”

The physician said members of the collective, who were aware of the Board of Supervisors’ directive, learned about the policy’s implementation last month only after searching through the Department of Health Services’ internal website. The department officially announced the policy a few days later by summarizing key points through email, according to the physician.

“The majority of health care workers are only going to know about the policy to the extent that is shared with them … and are not going to have the time and capacity to be digging deep into this internal website, finding the policy, reading it through [and] understanding it,” the physician said.

While health care facilities may fear retaliation by the Trump administration for being vocal about the rights of patients and immigrants, the physician said the Department of Health Services should “model the bravery and integrity” that its workforce has embodied since the beginning of the raids.

“These rights are not up for negotiation. They’re not flexible pending political circumstances,” the physician said.

A statement provided by the Department of Health Services said the policy is accessible to staff through a workforce portal, adding that a “guidance tool” has been distributed.

“We have also taken proactive steps to communicate this specific policy to all staff, supervisors, and managers through multiple internal channels, including all staff emails, hospital newsletters,” the statement said.

None of the hospitals or medical centers operated by LA Health Services have received a patient under civil custody, including ICE detention, since January 2026, according to the department.

This article was published in collaboration with LAist.

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Rebecca Trotzky-Sirr, a physician at LA General who has worked closely with patients in criminal custody, said hospitals across the country were caught off guard when the Trump administration’s aggressive immigration tactics led to an influx of patients brought in by ICE for emergency care. Many hospitals, including LA General, have clear protocols for handling patients in criminal detention, for example, after being arrested by a police officer. 

But most patients accompanied by ICE are civil, not criminal detainees.

“It took a long time for people to understand that,” she said. Trotzky-Sirr spoke with LAist as an individual physician, not on behalf of the Department of Health Services or LA General. 

Initially, she said, many health care workers assumed ICE had the same authority as criminal law enforcement agencies in medical settings to take precautions like restricting a patient’s communications.

“But that’s not what we should do," she said. "That’s not what we’re legally obligated to do.”

Plus, Trotzky-Sirr said, hospital staff, like anyone, might feel intimidated by a masked, armed agent.

“It’s hard to stand up confidently to someone with a gun,” she said. 

But staff members’ deference to the demands of federal immigration agents over patients’ rights  has been slowly changing, the doctor said, as more staff become educated on policies for handling detained patients, and especially, the difference between patients in civil custody versus criminal custody. Most patients who have been apprehended by ICE are civil, not criminal detainees.

“It took a long time for people to understand that,” the doctor said.

To Henry Perez, executive director of InnerCity Struggle, the county can strengthen awareness by working with organizations “with deep roots in the community.”

Perez, who has been involved in community efforts to protect patient rights at White Memorial, thinks of the county’s outreach work around housing and renters’ rights, partnering with organizations like Legal Aid Foundation of Los Angeles, Public Counsel and InnerCity Struggle. 

“There is a roadmap … and the county needs to reproduce that template that they already know how to do,” Perez said. “Just as housing is a critical issue in the community, so are immigrant rights and protections.

“A policy is only as good and as strong as its implementation and enforcement.”

Some Southern California legislators are trying to safeguard the rights of detained patients at the state level. State Sen. Caroline Menjivar, who represents Burbank and the San Fernando Valley, authored a bill, SB 915, that would, among other measures, prohibit immigration officers from remaining at a patient’s bedside unless there’s a credible risk of harm, or the officer has a valid judicial warrant.

A second bill, SB 1323, authored by state Sen. Susan Rubio, whose district stretches from El Monte to Ontario, would require hospital staff to immediately notify management when immigration agents show up. It would also require hospital management to instruct staff on how to respond to a detained patient’s request to notify family of their whereabouts. 

Both bills would apply to all health care entities in California, both public and private. 

The Department of Homeland Security did not respond to a request for comment by publication time. This story will be updated if a response is received.

What screams Thai more than pad Thai? Nothing. And on Sunday, the utilitarian stir-fried noodles will be the main character in an attempt to break a Guinness World Record.

The challenge? To serve and sell 1,200 plates of the stuff in 60 minutes. The headline-grabbing gambit is part of 17th Thai New Year Festival happening Sunday in Hollywood Thai Town.

Chinnakrit Soonthornwan (he said you can just call him Oak) came up with the idea to break the old Guinness record of around 1,000 plates. As of Thursday, the team already has received about 700 orders from participants.

 "I think it [is] very possible," Oak said of their chances to make history.  "It is going to be epic."

Also epic is the setting of this record-breaking attempt.

"It's all outside," Oak said. " There will be 35 restaurants working at the same time with big woks — like, gigantic woks."

Not to mention the 1,200 (or more) people chowing down on said noodles.

Pad Thai wasn't the first dish of choice. The team first landed on mango sticky rice.

"It seemed like everyone can eat it. It's vegan," he said.

But the popular dessert is difficult to make, and Oak added,  "It's Thai, but the name is not Thai."

Again, what screams Thai cuisine more than pad Thai?

"This is Thai. This is how we do it together," he said. "This is how we do world history."

Oak is also a co-founder of DS Night Market, a weekly Thai gathering proffering music and food taking place in Chinatown for the past couple years. He said his team has been regular attendees of the New Year festival and those born-and-raised in Thai Town have always wanted to help out.

"And we were like, 'We not gonna do something like they had done for 16 years,'" Oak said. "So we pitched them the pad Thai world record thing."

The bigger goal is to shed a spotlight on the community and to support the mom-and-pops. The pad Thai challenge is just one of the highlights. The all-day Sunday New Year celebration includes  five stages focusing on food, music, a beer garden and even boxing.

"We want to drive the business sales and bring more good vibes to Thai business owners," he said.