The Brief

Lawmakers and advocates say Gov. Gavin Newsom’s administration is making inflated estimates about the cost of legislation, with some suggesting his subordinates have been trying to kill the bills without making the governor politically accountable for the outcome.

“While people are dying on the streets from a lack of access to behavioral health care treatment, state agencies continue to fabricate exorbitant cost estimates,” Sen. Dave Cortese, a Democrat from Campbell, told CalMatters after one of his mental health proposals died recently in the Assembly Appropriations Committee.

Sen. Scott Wiener, a Democrat from San Francisco who authored another mental health bill that died recently, said in a public hearing last month that the administration’s cost estimate of his bill was “extreme and outrageous.”

The pointed accusations from Democratic lawmakers and health care advocates who tend to be friendly with the Democratic governor are extraordinary because such criticism is rarely made in public. The examples also stand out because they challenge the administration’s response on one of the governor’s top priorities, mental health.

The administration did not accept an interview request with CalMatters and would not provide more detail – to CalMatters or to lawmakers – to explain the cost estimates. By email, however, a spokesperson insisted the costs were accurate and rejected the idea that they were intentionally inflated.

“It’s outrageous and inaccurate for anyone to suggest these numbers are fabricated or artificially inflated,” Rodger Butler, a spokesperson for Newsom’s Health and Human Services Agency, said in an email. “Legislative fiscal analyses from state government departments are informed by real-world, on-the-ground experience implementing legislative mandates.”

Whatever the motivations, four health care bills with controversial cost estimates died quietly earlier this month in the Senate and Assembly Appropriations committees even after each had advanced without a single “no” vote from a Democratic legislator.

The Appropriations Committees are focused on the cost of legislation, especially in a year when the state is struggling with a budget deficit. The four bills were moved to the committees’ “suspense files” along with 263 other controversial or costly bills. Each committee then killed the bills in their respective suspense file with a single vote.

Mike Gatto, a former Democratic lawmaker from Los Angeles who chaired the Assembly Appropriations Committee, said inflated cost estimates from a governor’s administration are nothing new.

When an executive-branch agency provides “a significantly exaggerated cost” on a piece of legislation “it’s generally a big flashing light that the administration dislikes the bill and that the governor would likely veto it,” he said.

It can be advantageous for the governor when legislators quietly kill those bills, he said.

“Having the appropriations committee there to kill it and to take the arrows (of criticism), that is a tremendous benefit politically for any governor,” Gatto said.

Gatto has a hand-written note framed on his wall that former Gov. Jerry Brown gave him expressing Brown’s appreciation for keeping bills from reaching the governor’s desk.

In a corner of the note are two words: “Keep holding.”

But Thad Kousser, a former legislative staffer who’s now a professor of political science at UC San Diego, said the integrity of the legislative process is jeopardized if cost estimates are not accurate.

“You’ve got to have reasonable and realistic estimates that are not part of a political strategy in order for everyone to make informed decisions,” he said.

This year alone, according to the Digital Democracy database, lawmakers considered 2,522 bills, many of them with large potential costs to taxpayers.

Democrat calls costs ‘extreme and outrageous’

Sen. Wiener’s legislation, Senate Bill 294, would have required an automatic review of cases in which commercial health plans denied children and young people mental health treatment.

Wiener, the chair of the Senate’s mental health caucus, said in the public hearing last month that the measure “does nothing more than require health plans to provide the coverage that they’re required to provide and stop denying covered behavioral health care treatment to children.”

So he said it was “outrageous” when the Department of Managed Health Care estimated that the bill would cost $87.6 million per year by 2028 and would require 340 new employees. That’s a 55% increase over the 610 positions in the department’s budget for the 2022-23 fiscal year. A separate state office, the Department of Insurance, also said the bill would require it to hire an additional five positions by 2026 for $1.2 million. There is no description in the cost estimate about how the departments arrived at the estimate or what jobs the new positions would perform.

The estimate also was a surprise to supporters of Wiener’s bill. In June, they sent a three-page memo to the chair of the Assembly Appropriations Committee, Democrat Buffy Wicks from Oakland, saying that a similar bill that failed last year had a significantly lower cost estimate. They also noted that the pending bill was more narrow in scope.

Lishaun Francis, director of behavioral health for the advocacy group Children Now, told CalMatters the Department of Managed Health Care, which is intended to protect consumers, inflated the cost of Wiener’s bill, presumably to try to kill it.

“This is not an analysis in good faith,” she said. “The unfortunate thing here is that DMHC has fallen into a trap where they are trying to be here for consumers while also inflating costs to make sure bills don’t get to the governor when there is a tight budget year.”

Before the bill died, it passed the Senate and an Assembly committee without any Democrats voting against it, according to the Digital Democracy database.

Are there ‘multiple layers of fiscal review?’

The Department of Managed Health Care, which issued the cost estimates, is part of the state’s Health and Human Services Agency. Secretary Dr. Mark Ghaly, a Newsom appointee, oversees the agency.

CalMatters requested an interview with Ghaly or another top official to talk about the cost estimates, but the administration would not talk beyond providing the emailed statement from Butler at the Health and Human Services Agency.

“It’s important to note there are multiple layers of fiscal review throughout the process,” he said, citing the policy and appropriations committees in the Legislature and the governor’s Department of Finance.

But Department of Finance spokesman H.D. Palmer told CalMatters “we rely principally on (agencies and departments) to provide us with the personnel and fiscal estimates.”

Policy committees, meanwhile, don’t evaluate the costs of bills.

“To say that policy committees vetted the finances of a bill is almost uniformly incorrect,” said Gatto, the former Assembly Appropriations chair. “Policy committees don’t do that.”

That independent fiscal review is supposed to happen at the Assembly and Senate Appropriations Committees, whose staffers are widely regarded as some of the smartest people in the Capitol. Their job is to independently vet the administration estimate and provide their own cost estimates for bills, Kousser and Gatto said.

“These people are professionals,” Kousser said. “They’re trying to get it right.”

Yet when it came to these four disputed bills, the analysis written by the staffs of the Appropriations Committees described the administration cost estimates and nothing more. Each of the four analysis included language similar to SB 999, which said only: “The Department of Managed Health Care (DMHC) reports the total costs of this bill as follows:”

Luis Quinonez, chief of staff for Sen. Anna Caballero of Merced, who chairs the Senate’s Appropriations Committee, declined to discuss specific bills, other than to say the committee’s consultants perform their own analyses.

Representatives for Assemblymember Wicks, who chairs the Assembly Appropriations Committee, did not return messages.

Another Democrat calls costs ‘exorbitant’ 

Regarding his mental health bill, Sen. Cortese said in an email he has “serious concerns about how the health care agencies are coming up with these cost projections.” Senate Bill 999 would have required health insurers to make sure they have mental health and addiction experts review claims for treatment, something advocates say already is required under state law.

This was the second time Cortese introduced the bill. A previous version made it through the Legislature in 2022 before Newsom vetoed it, saying the issue could be addressed by new regulations that would be issued soon.

After he felt draft regulations last year were inadequate, Cortese introduced a pared down version of the 2022 bill. But advocates were surprised to see the department’s cost estimate increase significantly to $18 million over five years and about $4 million annually after 2028 to pay for 13 permanent positions. The estimate does not explain how the department determined the number of positions needed or what jobs they would perform.

Advocacy groups supporting the bill noted that, in recent years’ budget allocations, the Department of Managed Health Care already received millions of dollars to cover some of the costs of implementing the proposed rules so it didn’t make sense that the costs would be so high.

“It’s sad to see some of these good faith efforts by advocates to try to bring accountability to the system kind of fall under the weight of a cost estimate that we don’t have a lot of insight into from the department,” said Lauren Finke, policy director for The Kennedy Forum, one of the bill’s sponsors.

Santa Cruz Democratic Assemblymember Gail Pellerin similarly couldn’t understand why there was such a high cost associated with her Assembly Bill 3260, which would have required health insurers to expedite reviews of mental health claims that doctors deem urgent.

The Department of Managed Health Care estimated the bill would cost nearly $140 million in the first five years and $32 million annually after 2029 to pay 144 new positions – a 23% increase in staff size, Pellerin said in an interview. The estimate, which also includes an additional $238,000 annually for the Department of Insurance, does not provide any further description about the need for the positions.

Sal Rosselli, president emeritus of the National Union of Healthcare Workers, which supported the bill, said in an email that his organization reached out to agency officials to ask for an explanation of the cost analysis, “but they declined to engage with us.”

Eleven other states, plus Washington, D.C. have already adopted similar laws, he said, with no evidence that those laws resulted in a major increase in workload.

Pellerin said she and her staff also couldn’t get an answer from the department about how it came up with what she called “inflated” numbers.

“Is this taxpayer-funded state department doing the job it is required to do?” she asked.

For Pellerin, the issue is personal. She knows first-hand how an urgent mental health crisis can spiral out of control. Her husband died by suicide in 2018.

“My family, we’ve experienced this kind of situation,” she told CalMatters.

Are agencies not showing their work?

Advocates for Health Access California also were frustrated by the cost estimates associated with Assembly Bill 236 by Pasadena Democratic Assemblymember Chris Holden. The bill would have given state regulators the authority to fine health insurers if their publicly available lists of in-network doctors and specialists aren’t accurate.

In testimony supporting the bill’s promises to crack down on so-called “ghost networks,” a therapist described having a patient end up in the emergency room from a suicide attempt after she called through a list of 50 mental health providers and couldn’t find one who’d see her.

The bill would have added teeth to a law that insurers and doctors are already supposed to be following and that state regulators are supposed to be monitoring.

The Department of Managed Health Care estimated its cost to be $3.5 million annually after 2029 for 14 new positions. In its one-sentence description, the Department of Health Care Services said its cost for the bill would be "approximately" $24 million. In an email, the department told CalMatters the bill would lead to “increased costs in the Medi-Cal managed care and behavioral health delivery systems and staffing requirements.”

“This $24 million is just mind-blowing,” said Rachel Linn Gish, a spokesperson for Health Access. “We do not understand how they came up with this number.”

Michael Genest spent four years as Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger’s director of the Department of Finance. At CalMatters’ request, he reviewed the cost estimates of the four bills.

He said he could expect high costs for Wiener’s and Pellerin’s bills, but he said it wasn’t possible for him to independently evaluate the figures without more detail.

But he said the other two estimates definitely seemed out of line based on the information the administration and the committees provided.

He said it wouldn’t surprise him if the agencies were inflating the projected costs of the bills to try to get more money to backfill their budgets – or if top officials in Newsom’s administration had told departments to oppose bills that weren’t the governor’s priorities.

Either way, he said the agencies should do a better job of explaining their cost projections.

“It’s poor practice,” he said. “It’s not a good thing that they’re not showing the detail.”

Genest worked in the Capitol when Willie Brown was Assembly speaker and when John Burton was president of the Senate. He said those leaders, known for their aggressive leadership styles, would never let the governor’s administration get away with blowing off lawmakers’ concerns. Back then, he said, lawmakers would have threatened to cut the departments’ budgets if they felt they were getting the runaround.

“If a member was disrespected to that extent by a member of the bureaucracy,” he said, “there would be consequences.”

Winter may seem like a season of stillness, but science tells us a different story.

Even in the quiet winter months, the natural world buzzes with activity. Insect migration patterns shift, animal survival tactics kick in, and tiny engineering feats unfold as snowflakes form in the sky.

These five Deep Look videos bring that hidden winter world to life.

The sex lives of Christmas trees

When forests grow quiet in winter, pine cones emerge as the reproductive engines of conifers, with male and female cones playing distinct roles.

The male cones release clouds of pollen in spring, but the female cones do the real winter magic: they hold the seeds.

Their armor-like scales act like tiny gates, opening just wide enough to catch pollen spread by the wind, then sealing shut for months as the seeds develop inside.

When conditions are just right, often during crisp, dry weather, the cones flex open again and let the seeds whirl out into the cold air, find a home in the ground and grow into the next generation of trees. Conifers survived ice ages, fires, and everything in between with this ancient system, as old as 300 million years.

Why reindeer and their cousins are total boneheads

Every year, male reindeer grow an entirely new set of antlers, essentially full bones that sprout from their heads in a process fueled by testosterone.

In summer, these antlers are wrapped in velvet, a dense skin rich in blood vessels that nourish the fast-growing bone. Come fall, the velvet sheds, revealing the smooth, polished antlers, the reindeer use to spar with rivals and impress potential mates.

But after this courtship season ends and hormone levels drop, the antlers simply fall off. Squirrels, mice and other winter scavengers gnaw on the cast-off antlers for calcium.

Within weeks, the reindeer begin growing the next set. They may not fly, but they’re winter’s most impressive bone-builders.

Identical snowflakes? Scientist ruins winter for everyone

Each snowflake starts as a tiny water-vapor speck freezing into an icy hexagon.

As it tumbles through clouds, temperature and humidity shape its branches, making each one’s journey and pattern unique.

But in a lab, physicist Ken Libbrecht can actually make identical snowflakes by precisely controlling the conditions.

Nature may be unpredictable, but science proves it can be repeatable, at least under the right conditions.

You’d never guess what an acorn woodpecker eats

In the oak woodlands of the West, acorn woodpeckers spend the colder months guarding something very valuable: thousands of acorns meticulously stored in their communal granaries.

These birds drill hole after hole into trees, sometimes over generations, to create a kind of pantry wall where they can tap acorns in like a wooden peg.

Acorn woodpeckers live in family groups and spend winter tending their stash and defending it from thieves. Come spring, they’ll shift to insects and oak flowers, but in winter, acorns fuel their lively, noisy, and highly social world.

Loveliness of ladybugs

Did you know that a cluster of these insects is known as a “loveliness of ladybugs”?

Just when the cold sets in and their favorite foods, like aphids, disappear, ladybugs join one of the most surprising winter gatherings in nature.

These usually solitary insects take to the air, riding wind currents toward mountain slopes where their ancestors have clustered for years. They’re guided by pheromone trails that act like tiny chemical breadcrumbs.

When they arrive, they pile together in rust-colored heaps, sometimes thousands strong. This communal hibernation is their best chance of surviving winter, and since most only live a year, it’s also their one shot at reproducing in spring.

Stealing a smooch under the mistletoe is a time-honored holiday tradition — but the word itself has an origin that invokes the exact opposite of romance.

As part of NPR's "Word of the Week" series, we're exploring the history of the plant's name, diving into the tradition of kissing beneath it, and taking a scientific detour along the way.

The etymology of mistletoe — a plant with small, oval evergreen leaves and waxy white berries — likely comes from the Anglo-Saxon words for manure — "mist" or "mistel" — and "tan" (sometimes rendered as "toe"), meaning "twig" or "stick."

"It literally means bird poop on a twig," according to Susie Dent, a British lexicographer and author of Guilt by Definition.

The name stems from the way its seeds are carried by birds and dropped after passing through their digestive tract. This method of seed dispersal is called endozoochory, says Tristram Seidler, a biology professor at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst, and the curator of the UMass Amherst Herbarium.

In short, animals eat fruits, including berries, move on and "deposit" the seeds in a different location, he says. For mistletoe seeds, that location happens to be the tops of trees. From an evolutionary standpoint, Seidler says, species survival can depend on getting seeds away from the parent plant.

"Any seeds that land near their parent plant may germinate," he explains. "But they're almost certainly going to be wiped out by disease because those areas tend to be crowded and small plants are very susceptible to their own pathogens."

Humans, then, make use of the mistletoe spread by those birds — planting it in cultural practices that stretch back into antiquity.

Mistletoe history

The oldest customs surrounding mistletoe are likely tied to celebrations of the winter solstice, according to Bettina Arnold, a professor of anthropology at the University of Wisconsin–Milwaukee. These go back to the Neolithic era in prehistoric Europe.

"All agricultural societies would have made note of [the winter solstice] because it literally is the time when… you can start seeing the days getting longer again," she says. "So it's a return to life after sort of a seasonal death, in a way." The mistletoe, being evergreen, "is actually almost a metaphor for that."

Arnold says that Pliny the Elder, a first-century Roman author, provided a detailed account of mistletoe and its use by druids, a nature- and ritual-focused priesthood that lived in Iron Age Gaul (modern-day France) and the British Isles. Pliny said that when they found mistletoe growing on a particular kind of oak tree, a priest in white vestments would climb up to cut down the mistletoe with a golden sickle.

"They believe that mistletoe given in drink will impart fertility to any animal that is barren, and that it is an antidote for all poisons," Pliny wrote. (In fact, modern medical literature says the exact opposite).

Given mistletoe's association with fertility and rebirth, it's not surprising that it made its way into Christian tradition, Arnold says, noting that although we often forget it today, "the Roman Catholic Church is really kind of an extension of the Roman Empire." The Romans themselves also had their own solstice tradition that seeped into Christian practice: Saturnalia, in honor of the god of agriculture, Saturn, included decorating homes with evergreen boughs, wreaths and garlands to symbolize renewal.

Norse mythology adds another mistletoe tale — of Baldur, the god of light. In a story reminiscent of the Greek hero Achilles, Baldur's mother, Frigg, makes her son invincible to all things except mistletoe. Loki, the trickster, exploits this unusual weakness by using an arrow made of mistletoe to kill Baldur. In some later versions of the story, Frigg's tears over her son's death become mistletoe berries, symbolizing her love.

Plant a kiss

So, what about all the kissing?

A reference appears in a song from the 1784 musical comedy Two for One, which celebrates "what good luck has sent ye / And kiss beneath the mistletoe."

It's the oldest written reference to the custom, according to Arnold. It appears to have gained popularity in the following centuries, with holiday themes of regeneration, renewal and redemption helping to reinforce it.

According to author Dent, the story of mistletoe reflects this transformation, evolving from a "slightly scatological beginning … [to] blossom into something rather beautiful."

Copyright 2025 NPR

I hope your holidays are very merry so far. Here at LAist, we headed out to the Norton Simon Museum in Pasadena recently to get a fresh look at the art collection, which is celebrating its 50th anniversary. If you have time in this light traffic (and rainy!) week, it’s worth the ride to check out this gem. Or if old Hollywood glam is more your thing, Fiona Ng scoped out the ASU FIDM museum downtown, which has more than 300 artifacts in its care that you can visit — including many pieces worn by Marlene Dietrich.

Licorice Pizza’s music picks for the weekend include the Dirty Dozen Brass Band at the Mint on Friday, plus RL Grime at Academy L.A. and Quiet Riot at the Whisky a Go Go, both also on Friday. Sunday has hair metal vets the BulletBoys at the Whisky, and actress and performance artist Ann Magnuson will do an encore performance of her “The Luv Show - 30th Anniversary” Celebration at Zebulon.

Elsewhere on LAist.com, learn about the final shows at the Hotel Cafe before it moves and get a glimpse of LACMA’s first Van Gogh acquisition.

Events

Mythical Creatures: The Stories We Carry

Preview through Sunday, January 4
Pacific Asia Museum 
46 N. Los Robles Ave., Pasadena
COST: FREE; MORE INFO

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David Kim

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Pacific Asia Museum

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A museum-wide installation takes over USC’s Pacific Asia Museum starting in February, but you can get a sneak preview at the innovative project, conceived by Los Angeles-based Korean American artist and muralist Dave Young Kim, over the holidays. Mythical Creatures is an immersive exhibit that spans 12 rooms and tells visitors a story in verse across the museum’s walls. It features 100 objects from USC PAM’s diverse collection of Asian art, as well as new work from Dinh Q. Lê, Lily Honglei, Wendy Park, Momoko Schafer, Kyungmi Shin, Sanjay Vora, Lauren YS and more.

Pee-wee’s Playhouse Christmas Special

Saturday, December 27, 5 p.m.
Alex Theatre 
216 N. Brand Blvd., Glendale
COST: FROM $19; MORE INFO

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Courtesy The Alex Theatre

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Artist Shepard Fairey is DJing, the Bob Baker Marionette Theater is performing and DJ Lance Rock is hosting this charity screening of the iconic 1988 Pee-wee’s Playhouse Christmas Special. The evening will benefit AnimAID, which helps animation professionals whose lives have been affected by the wildfires. The movie is followed by a holiday concert at 8 p.m. with Tom Kenny & the Hi-Seas.

The Wonderful Winter of Oz 

Through Sunday, December 28 
Scherr Forum at Bank of American Performing Arts Center
2100 E. Thousand Oaks Blvd., Thousand Oaks
COST: FROM $42; MORE INFO

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Lythgoe Family Panto

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A very British tradition at Christmastime is going to a panto — a pantomime — with your family and friends. For the uninitiated, a panto is a sort of mistold fairy tale rewritten with audience participation, bawdy (but typically kid-friendly) humor and colorful costumes and sets. The Lythgoe Family Panto brings a taste of that to L.A. every year, this year with The Wonderful Winter of Oz, starring none other than J. Peterman himself, John O’Hurley.

When Harry Met Sally… 

Saturday and Sunday, December 27 and 28, 11 a.m. 
Art Theatre 
2025 E. 4th St., Long Beach 
COST: $13; MORE INFO

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Columbia Pictures

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Honor Rob Reiner’s legacy by heading to Long Beach for a screening of the best holiday movie and best rom-com of all time (don’t @ me), When Harry Met Sally…

2025 Sundance Film Festival Short Film Tour

Sunday, December 28, 7 p.m.
Los Feliz Theatre
1822 N. Vermont Ave., Los Feliz
COST: $17; MORE INFO

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Courtesy American Cinematheque

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Take the opportunity to see some great indie shorts as American Cinematheque and Vimeo present a showcase of seven standouts from this year’s Sundance Film Festival. The event is followed by a Q&A with the filmmakers.

S.H.I.N.E. Mawusa

Saturday, December 27, 2 p.m. to 4:30 p.m. 
World Stage
4321 Degnan Blvd., Leimert Park
COST: $5 SUGGESTED DONATION; MORE INFO

Every Saturday, S.H.I.N.E. Mawusi — Sisters Healing, Inspiring, Nurturing, and Empowering, in the Hands of God — brings West African drum culture to the L.A. community. World Stage hosts this suggested donation-only performance, which teaches African culture through music and dance.

Laboratory for the Future

Through January 4, Thursdays to Sundays, 12 p.m. to 5 p.m.
Propeller Gallery 
Airport Arts Center
3026 Airport Ave., Santa Monica 
COST: FREE; MORE INFO

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Courtesy Debra Scacco

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Debra Scacco’s work is only on display for another couple of weeks; make sure you get over to Santa Monica Airport to see the project from the beach city’s first Public Works Department Artist in Residence program before it’s gone in early January. Scacco explores the relationship between “water, waste, and urban ecology” and uses clay from Santa Monica’s water well excavation alongside portraits of city essential workers in the installation.

Holiday tours & Vault Experience

Saturday and Sunday, December 27 and 28
Petersen Automotive Museum 
6060 Wilshire Blvd., Miracle Mile
COST: $150; MORE INFO

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Courtesy Petersen Automotive Museum

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If you left the car fanatic in your life off your list, this is the perfect opportunity to make up for the oversight. Included in your Peterson Automotive Museum admission is a special tour of the Vault — home to many rare and vintage cars — a trip to the museum’s mechanic’s shop, where restoration work on the vehicles is ongoing, and a gift certificate to the museum’s restaurant, Meyers Manx.

Papusas and Punchlines

Friday, December 26, 7:30 p.m.
Jaragua Restaurant
4493 Beverly Blvd., Mid-City 
COST: FROM $19.50; MORE INFO 

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Papusas and Punchlines

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Eventbrite

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Eat delicious papusas and laugh till it hurts at Jaragua for their ongoing Papusas and Punchlines series, this week with a holiday theme. Comics from HBO, Jimmy Kimmel Live and more will perform.

Aparna Nancherla’s comedy career spans almost two decades. She started in standup, has written for shows like Mythic Quest and Late Night with Seth Meyers, and acted in shows like Search Party, Corporate and BoJack Horseman.

After taking a break from standup to write a memoir turned into an extended hiatus.

”I was mining some real, raw personal depths and facing some parts of myself that I hadn't looked at really closely,” Nancherla told LAist. “And then I think trying to get up in front of a bunch of strangers at night was just too much for my nervous system.”

Nancherla is now back with her first hour-long special.

In Hopeful Potato — available now on Dropout, a streaming service dedicated to comedy — she shares her journey navigating her social anxiety in everyday life.

Nancherla joined LAist All Things Considered host Julia Paskin to talk about how she deals with anxiety and depression and her recommendations for places to decompress in L.A.

Good advice and bad mental health advice she’s received

Julia Paskin: Let's talk about good advice.

Aparna Nancherla:  Ironically, the internet's recommendation to touch grass. I think seeing actual people being a little out in the world [and] spending time in nature, those are all things that have helped me. But also realizing that your coping mechanisms are not always gonna work the way you want them to. Deep breathing or taking a self-care day, sometimes it won't make you feel better… I think that just accepting that's part of it too. Like some days you're just gonna feel bad and that doesn't mean you failed.

Julia Paskin:  Could I ask you [for] some of your top worst tips you've received for dealing with depression and anxiety?

Aparna Nancherla:  I've heard, "Just don't think about it." I'm like, "Oh yeah, I haven't tried that." [Also],  something along the lines of: "Suck it up. We're all having a hard time. Everyone's a little depressed." That kind of thing. And honestly, I do find going for a walk or exercising or drinking more water, those can be helpful things. But I think people often utilize them as the solution, like this will cure you. And I'm like, there is not really a cure. It's an ongoing, non-linear journey, and I don't think people understand that.

Places to avoid being a hermit

Julia Paskin:  You talk in the special about having had "big hermit energy" at one point [...] You mentioned touching grass. Any particular spots in L.A. to go touch grass?

Aparna Nancherla:  I mean, very on-brand for me, but I love a coffee shop, I love a library, something where you're around people, but maybe you don't have to directly engage with them, but there's some social contact…  I do think it's [...] important to kind of push myself to be out in the world. 'Cause I think sometimes it can be a slippery slope with being like, is this really a self-care day at this point? You haven't seen anyone for 10 days. Like maybe this is more a sign [that] you need to have lunch with a friend.

Just a couple months ago, [I] got a membership to the L.A. County Arboretum… [I’m an] admirer of waterfalls, and they have a big one planted right in the middle called the Meyberg Waterfall. And it is just one of my really happy places.

Julia Paskin:  Do you have a favorite library or bookshop or anything like that, that you'd recommend?

Aparna Nancherla: I'm in Pasadena, so I love the Pasadena Public Library system. …  There's actually a library I really love in Glassell Park. The Eagle Rock Library I love. And then there's just like great coffee shops around those places too, like Habitat and Penny Oven.

Navigating mental health in an unstable entertainment industry

The unpredictability of the entertainment industry — from the shuttering of studios during the pandemic, to fears of AI and the potential effect of corporate mergers on jobs — has increased anxiety for people working in Hollywood. Nancherla’s advice for dealing with this uncertainty? Support one another.

Aparna Nancherla:  I think what helps in these moments is as a creator [thinking] what can I make? What brings me joy? What connects me to other people? And for me it is kind of going back to smaller things where it's like [doing] a local show. I just did a fundraiser for a local L.A. Councilmember Eunisses Hernandez, who's doing such great work with housing and people's wages. And I think it's so important to remember there are degrees of power and ways we can show up for each other that don't have to do with billionaires, and mergers and things that hopefully people can work towards changing, but might not change overnight.

Nancherla’s comedy special "Hopeful Potato’"is available to stream now on Dropout.

This interview has been edited for clarity.