LAist: SaMo Police Spent $3K on Critical Mass Operations

andytseng

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 13:28:18 -0800

Last time I was driving around with a broken headlight, a cop pulled me over and installed a brand new headlight for me. Oh wait, that's not what happened. He gave me a ticket, and I was on my way. Maybe LAist should write about that instead of a bunch of hipsters in a circle-jerk about how they're saving the planet.

scotyosh

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 17:40:41 -0800

I know Gary. But would not it be great? I envision the sound of 4 spray paint cans at one time hitting the car synchronized; Blinding the driver side window and door. Nothing better than to get the guy that tried to mame you out of their pod induced state so you he can deal with you and your friends personally... Hell, at least LA body shops would be all for it!

GarySe7en

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 17:17:24 -0800

I have to disagree with the sentiment if they mess with us we trash their car. Besides being against the law, even if they broke the law first, it is those kinds of incidents that get snapped up out of context by the media to perpetuate the myth of the scofflaw cyclist. People may respect messengers if only of fear that they will hit back, but that does nothing for the regular folks out there trying to commute by bike.

scotyosh

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 13:03:54 -0800

I liken this debate to the neighbor that complains about loud kids in a family suburb. I know that Los Angeles is the car city of America. If I really wanted to get into biking, I would live eslewhere. That being said, people that feel elite enough to feel they own the road, are waiting for a fight. I suggest bikers ride in packs, and to fuck up the cars and people that get aggressive with them. When I lived in SF, messengers would group together and completely trash cars once they stopped at a red light. Not that you can get it away with it here, but hell, if someone is trying to run you off the road, I say run their cars to the body shop. Somehow those bike messengers always got respect... (ok maybe i am being a little asinine, but you catch my drift)

Jessica Pauline

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 11:38:31 -0800

skd, seriously??? you're going to compare the fight for bike lanes to the civil rights movement? i'm pretty sure that comparison renders everything that you say completely moot. bikers, if there are any of you out there that don't sound like self-righteous, spoiled and undereducated idiots, you should probably jump in because right now your "spokespeople" are doing you a great disservice. GarySe7en is doing his best to man the fort but he's pretty much alone in his rational points...

jonnyboy

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 15:56:52 -0800

Roadways are for cars, busses, motorcycles, and bicycles to share equally. That's what we are talking about.

Hindinwood

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 13:17:12 -0800

^^^^ Pedestrians walk on the road every time they cross the street. That's what I was talking about...

skd

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 11:10:20 -0800

Pedestrians do not have a right to walk on the road, bicyclists do. All we want is what the law gives us. The right to ride on the road without being threatened, injured and killed. So far we are not getting our rights.

GarySe7en

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 10:26:40 -0800

I'll be honest, I'm on the side of SMCM, but really the rhetoric could come down a notch or two. There is a difference between making a case for ideas, arguing passionately for those ideals, and then there is lashing out and belittling people with childish insults, which doesn't benefit anyone. Yes, sometimes cyclists are subject to out right prejudice, and have garbage thrown at them unprovoked (had this happen to me), and far worse, be intimidated with the car it self (encountered this too). But if we throw garbage back, all we are doing is escalating the situation and bringing our selves down to the lowest common denominator. Skd, you evoke the imagery of the civil rights movement, but do you recall M.L.K. giving any speeches about his enemies testicular fortitude, come on now. P.S. For readers of these exchanges, keep in mind people who show up to mass rides are of a vary diverse range. Some are very politically motivated, and some just want the refuge of numbers to safely ride on the street in an social atmosphere, and various flavors in between. I'm tired of people on both sides of this issue generalizing every one into with us or against us, and not acknowledging that most people are somewhere in between and we need to coexist. Most cyclists who ride in mass are not anarchists with no concern for anyone but their agenda, and most motorists are decent folks who are not interested in running cyclists off the road. When the SMPD comes out with fire hoses or knocking cyclists off their bikes like in N.Y., then maybe some elevated rhetoric would be in order. Peace.

Hindinwood

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 10:25:28 -0800

^^^^ Okay but come on, pedestrians are threatened by vehicles every day, as are other vehicles! It's the nature of the road in LA. People are competitive agressive drivers, and I don't know how much a protest is going to change that....

skd

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 02:45:23 -0800

Tone down the rhetoric? We ride our bikes and are threatened by vehicles everyday, you expect us to take this shit?! Take your place in the back of the bus if you want. Shuffle two steps behind the man, like a coward lapdog. If you don't have the testicular fortitude to fight for your equal rights,than you are worthless. Drive your damn car. Bicyclists have equal rights according to the law and the California Vehicle Code, yet we are not allowed to exercise those rights. So like the Civil Rights movement, we will get in your face until you accept it. Kapish? Pfft.

GarySe7en

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 19:54:15 -0800

"Yeah and Team100 raised nearly $300,000 without pissing off large portions of the city at one time or another. So why are the Ridazz so far behind?" Team 100, as the name suggests has many participants, and grew out of the long standing club Shifting Gears to try and create the largest AIDS LifeCycle team every done. They have been working at developing a system for preparing riders and raising money for many years as well as securing big name sponsors, making them one of the biggest non-profit groups for any fundraising event of this nature. I was nominated the team captain of the Midnight Ridazz ALC team, which began as a small handful of riders last October who signed up, and grew to about 20 in the end. We had a working relationship with several riders from Team 100, who gave us advice and encouragement for our new team. I had never before led such an enormous under taking, and our team was made up of many young riders without a lot of personal income or connections. Raising $56,000 was a huge grass roots effort for us, and we tried everything we could from selling cookies and t-shirts at mass rides to bike washes, yard sales, and even a photography show. We put a lot sweat blood and tears into pulling it off, and trying to make sure every rider was hitting their fundraising goals. I would appreciate our efforts not being trivialized simply because a larger more organized team raised more then we did. Team 100 may have raised $300,000, but $11 million was raised this year because of the hard efforts of every rider and every team. If $56,000 is so easy to raise, lets see you and your friends do it, it's just chump change right.

desiringmachine

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 14:12:46 -0800

The riders at the last CM in LA almost ran down a few pedestrians at Sunset and Vermont (right by a busy ER, BTW). I know because I got to sit through 2 green lights and watch them. Until that, I always thought Critical Mass was cool - I had never participated but I own a bike, I love to ride, I was looking forward to getting back in shape enough to join them one night. Bikes ARE traffic, they have the same rights as other vehicles, I always thought the point of CM was to remind people of that. But apparently the actual point was just to be a bunch of assholes. I told the guy corking us in that he was fucking it up for other cyclists - I want to ride my bike to the grocery store without having the motorists around me pissed off because they had to sit at a light for 15 minutes the night before because of some other cyclists. He thanked me for my understanding while others in the pack laughed at us because we weren't willing to run them over and had to sit. So, in the end, I was all for their movement, I would have protested police action against them...now if a bunch of cruisers penned in the next pack and arrested them all I'd walk right by. Good Job CM!

armin tanzarian

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 13:01:34 -0800

"This same Midnight Ridazz also produced a team of riders who cycled from SF to LA for AIDS LifeCycle and raised $56,000 for charity in the process." Yeah and Team100 raised nearly $300,000 without pissing off large portions of the city at one time or another. So why are the Ridazz so far behind?

jonnyboy

Sat, 06 Sep 2008 17:21:45 -0800

What a great SMCM, there were many cases in which the SMPD was telling bicyclists over the loud speaker to actually disobey the laws stated in CVC 21202. Perfect execution and excellent turnout. Unlike most other SMCM's, the group was able to stay together in full force until the end. There were some tickets issued, but I highly doubt that it will amount to anything considering how many cops they had out there. Also, I have heard that some of the tickets issued were for bogus reasons (no surprise here, it has happened many times before). This was truly a protest ride (not the party on wheels type at all), and a successful protest at that. The past few months it seemed that SMCM had taken a loss to the police presence, but new forms of execution were able to lead Santa Monica Critical Mass participants to a big win this month. Hopefully the Santa Monica Police Department continues to waste a lot of their resources trying to control Santa Monica Critical Mass. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that with the new style of execution, Santa Monica Critical Mass could keep the entire police force busy well into the night with harmless styles of protesting. Maybe after they waste enough time and effort, they will give up (or at least back off) and realize that we only mean well. We are bicyclists- not murderers or rapists. Shouldn't the police actually be trying to keep SM crime free on a Friday night? That is up to you, city of Santa Monica.

grendel20

Sat, 06 Sep 2008 11:27:31 -0800

I concur, sir jackjood. I concur.

jackjood

Sat, 06 Sep 2008 10:26:27 -0800

^^^^^ Tone down the rhetoric!! You sound ridiculous and are embarassing decent, normal, everyday cyclists.

skd

Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:07:09 -0800

I just returned from Santa Monica Critical Mass tonight. The SMPD was out in force, burning gasoline and wasting taxpayer dollars. They also rode their BMW motorcycles in a dangerous and aggressive fashion, that one day will result in serious injury or worse. The residents of the Santa Monica neighborhoods we rode through were appalled by the massive police presence and were very supportive of the group bicycle ride. They intend to call their city council and the Santa Monica Police to complain. We will ride in Santa Monica, and bleed the resources of the police department until the time we are given the same rights as the cars on the road. Legally, according to State law and the California Vehicle code, bicyclists are accorded the same rights and privileges as a motor vehicle on the street. Yet we are treated as second-class citizens. We will not accept it nor go to the back of the bus. You want a piece of this? We'll give it to you everyday until you accept our presence on the road as equals. Get use to it. We will not fade away.

GarySe7en

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:08:10 -0800

Midnight Ridazz is not one entity, it's a public forum. The people who organize rides through it are very diverse, and even a well intentioned ride planner cannot account for everyone who shows up and how they behave, but the try the best the can. Internal discussions of ethics are frequent, and I agree anyone holding up traffic in front of an ER is way out of line, and should have been called out immediately for it. Because a couple ass holes show up to a ride of 300 people is not a reflection of the diversity of a group. This same Midnight Ridazz also produced a team of riders who cycled from SF to LA for AIDS LifeCycle and raised $56,000 for charity in the process. Broad generalizations of a large group of people because of a particular incident or ass hole rider is an over simplification.

armin tanzarian

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 21:43:26 -0800

"Don't give me cyclists will obstruct emergency vehicles bull shit." On the second to last Midnight Ridazz ride I ever went on (back in '04 before riding a bike was even considered cool) the route went past the Kaiser hospital at Sunset/Vermont. A fellow "rida" tried helping everyone out by corking the intersection that happened to be the entrance to the ER. Sure enough a car pulls up and honks its horn. Not in an annoyed way but in a we've-got-a-situation-that-requires-a-trip-to-the-ER sort of way. Instead of realizing the difference, the chap corking the intersection decided to get up on his high horse and give the "inconsiderate" driver a peace of his mind. Finally, a few of us pointed out that the lady riding shot gun was bleeding profusely from the face and he grudgingly let them pass and I went straight home realizing that perhaps the Midnight Ridazz wasn't a good group to associate with.

GarySe7en

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 20:45:35 -0800

"so...what does CM do when there is a fire truck or ambulance that needs to get through the traffic tie up?" I hear this one a lot and I have to laugh. Cyclists are able to quickly and efficiently in mass get onto a sidewalk in the event of an emergency. Cars on the other hand are extremely limited in their mobility. I frequently see emergency vehicles stuck because car traffic, which you know exists whether bikes are present or not, is all sitting there at loss for what to do with their jaws hanging open while peoples lives at stake. Don't give me cyclists will obstruct emergency vehicles bull shit.

qwerty

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:27:54 -0800

Jonnyboy, nice save with the last comment, but you should really reread your first two posts before you criticize the attitudes of others. Until you spoke in a measured tone, you were basically the poster child of why I like biking but hate cyclists. The holier-than-thou, fuck you bro bullshit is counterintuitive to say the least. And for the record, critical mass WILL end. As soon as someone gets fatally struck by a car or bus, it's over. I came damn close last month when I was making a left turn and a bunch of dumbfucks, you guessed it, rolled right through their red light. I like the idea of critical mass, but the execution is shit.

solange

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:45:11 -0800

Forgive me if I'm wrong, as I am not from California, but would you not need a permit to organize a demonstration?

90039

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:38:14 -0800

so...what does CM do when there is a fire truck or ambulance that needs to get through the traffic tie up? SHARE the road.

danwuh

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:27:54 -0800

Ive commuted by bike for several years now, both in LA and elsewhere. Critical Mass rides may heighten awareness and spark heated debates as the one above and that may well be the intended result. In my experience, the only thing that will stop this (global) bickering between car drivers and cyclists is if both parties start obeying the rules of the road. Sadly, as with anything, someone somewhere will flagrantly ignore specific traffic laws to make their life easier, whether on a bike or car, horse, gocart, motorbike (its a BIKE lane, not MOTORbike Lane). As soon as one party is seen breaking the law, the holier than thou argument is out of the window. Its human nature, I personally wish for more traffic cameras. In the end just remember we're all human beings, not vehicular entities. When you do something dumb on the road you put a life at risk, not just your insurance premium.

jonnyboy

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:05:47 -0800

LOL

ven_nm

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 17:22:38 -0800

Don't get your biker shorts in a little ball - someone could just throw a bunch of thumb tacks by the pier and have a critically flat mass of tires. Solution critically solved.

jonnyboy

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 17:10:49 -0800

Hindinwood- I understand what you are saying. I actually commute by bike, and I can assure you that I follow traffic rules on main roads. Yes I will admit that at stop signs in quiet residential areas that I usually just slow down and give a quick look left & right... If there are no cars around then I just roll through it. There! Ya got me. Sorry. In all seriousness though, I think it's a terrible idea to run reds on main roads- especially in thick traffic as a lone cyclist- and I am not at all suggesting that ALL cyclists regardless of the scenario should be able to disobey the rules of the road. I think I should have been more specific when I mentioned traffic laws previously... When in a group, I think it is much safer to travel as a conglomerate whole rather than a bunch of individual groups of bike traffic. Drivers that are already stopped for a passing group of bikes have enough common sense to stay stopped and let the group pass... This is not only safer but much more efficient as far as traffic. When the group gets split up, there are many more chances for drivers that are unaware to interact with bike riders. This is SO much more dangerous in my opinion. Plus, it holds up traffic way longer with group rides like Critical Mass. I am sorry that I got heated so quickly- but when you, with no experience of riding in a group, start generalizing everyone who rides in a big group as "self-centered", I feel the need to become defensive. Additionally, you generalized that those who participate in Critical Mass are "elitist" and have no idea how to raise awareness of the problem (you said it was purely "theatrical"), when everything that you recommended here has already been tried before (at no avail). Hopefully you can understand my point about the safety of riding in a group such as Critical Mass. I think that SMPD is causing way more harm than good... Not only with their actions, but with their attitude as well.

GarySe7en

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 17:04:39 -0800

I wouldn't be so defensive of SMCM if it weren't for the fact that as a group they curbed their behavior to comply with police, by stopping at reds, and doing stop signs in small waves to allow cross traffic through, and even handing out lights to encourage riders to comply with night riding regulation, and yet continued to get tickets whether a real violation existed or not.

Hindinwood

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 16:33:35 -0800

I am glad to see that some of the latter commenters are being more objective, and they definitely have some points (GarySe7en for sure). I'm sure it is extremely frustrating to deal with city beaurocracy (sp?), and maybe other direct action/creative tactics are in order. However, it's unfortunate that some supporters of CM feel the need to get so vitriolic with their defense, as it really undermines their cause. First of all, I don't have anything against cyclists! I can not stress this enough. I think CM is a fine idea in theory, but it's logic like this that defeats their cause; "Instead the SMPD is forcing the group to stop at stop lights and stop signs, which actually slows you down even more in your silly bus." I can't believe someone ACTUALLY WROTE this!! Do you think because you're riding a bicycle you're above traffic laws? Red lights are there to protect you from hurtling pieces of steel that weigh tons and are coming in your direction. And what about the arrogance of the tone above? "Silly bus"? Once again, alienating allies. I don't live in SM, don't drive a car, and don't work at night, so quite frankly I really don't care. The only reason I posted in the first place was in reaction to this ridiculous statement; "Riders DO have a right to take over the whole road when they're in such large numbers. If auto drivers don't understand why, they should consider the fact that they take over the whole road EVERY DAY." The fact of the matter is, whether it's legal or not, it's still inconsiderate and potentially dangerous, especially if you decide to ignore red lights. Cars "take over the road every day" because the roads are currently designed for auto traffic (notice the lanes are car-sized)! While I agree that it should change, wishing it were so does not make it so.

GarySe7en

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 16:07:52 -0800

In response to the comments about, well why not talk to Metro, go to City Council meetings, why ride in mass as a public statement? Well the truth is a lot of cyclists, my self included now, have been writing letters, going to council meetings, and seeing time and time again officials nod and smile but not actually do anything. If talking to our city officials was all it took to get things done, a lot more would be getting done. I'll admit though I am cyclist who has participated in numerous mass rides of different varieties and parts of L.A., sometimes I have mixed feelings about their effectiveness sometimes. But the fact of the matter is asking nicely has not produced results, so many feel a need for there to be a call to action. As far Critical Mass rides go, SMCM is probably one of the most peaceful there is. And regardless of one's emotional feelings about critical mass, how do you rationally justify bogus traffic violations being handed out like candy. Yes some of them are real violations, but most of the ones I witnessed and photographed were not. This is blatant selective enforcement. The SMPD lines up for the chance to ticket SMCM, meanwhile everyday cyclists who are blatantly disregarding all laws, safety and common sense get off scott free. Lets ticket the critical mass rider for no lights even though he has 4 of them because he looked at us funny, but ignore the dudes who ride the wrong way against traffic after hopping off the sidewalks and through red lights with no lights on at night. I see that kind of thing all the time, but cops have no problem with those people, because they keep their mouths shut.

KinOfCain

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 16:02:51 -0800

Critical mass is a masturbatory exercise that makes the CM crew feel better about themselves but does nothing to further their stated cause. The "holier-than-thou" attitude of the CM folk and the way they insist that they should somehow be exempted from the traffic laws are what pisses everyone off, not to mention that you are purposely inconveniencing the very people you want on your side. It's like walking into a room, punching someone in the face, and then asking them to vote for you. I'm a bike-commuting individual but I don't bike everywhere. I agree that we should be doing more to improve the horrible bikeability of the LA region, but this immature self-righteous "cause" is counterproductive. I've never talked to a CM person who was able to separate the "lifestyle choice" of riding a bike from the legal and logistical changes that need to be made. It's fine if you want better (or existent) bike lanes, but the proselytizing and smug superiority of CM is just going to piss off people. And with all the angry motorists out there, did anyone from CM ever stop to think that maybe the police are protecting the bicyclists? A ticket's a lot less painful than a bumper to the rear wheel.

jonnyboy

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 15:58:17 -0800

(my last comment was for Johnny Black)

jonnyboy

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 15:56:52 -0800

You think you're pretty clever? LACM is already huge. It has around 400-500 participants. It starts at Wilshire & Western every last Friday of the month. I highly doubt that Critical Mass is threatened by the police force in SMCM, and I also doubt that Critical Mass gives a shit what you think about who is welcome in Santa Monica.

damian_z

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 15:54:15 -0800

I can't say I'm against Critical Mass, but I'm confused by the logic in the pro positions being offered here (admittedly from three different commentators.) livyatan and katiepoche insist that bikes have the same [legal] rights as cars in that they can take over lanes and use them just as cars do. But then jonnyboy blames the SMPD for wasting tax payer money by "forcing" Critical Mass to obey traffic laws when they ride, just like they do with cars? Kinda seems to me as if you can't have your cake and eat it too. Fighting for equal rights on the road by disobeying the traffic laws that get car drivers fined or thrown in jail seems to undermine the effort. As katiepoche points out: "Bikers have the same rights and responsibilities as motorists on the road." Why should SMPD allow Critical Mass to ignore traffic laws that all bicyclists, motorists and motorcyclists agree to obey in order to use the road? I admit the SMPD seem to be huge aggressive dicks about it, but *come on*.

Johnny Black

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 15:46:23 -0800

You don't like it, Critical Mass? Then take it to Downtown LA or somewhere else. You're not welcome in Santa Monica.

jonnyboy

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 15:25:41 -0800

Hindinwood- Why are you so bent out of shape because of Critical Mass? It happens merely once a month, and it is inevitably going to happen. Some people come to have fun and some people come to protest against the city of Santa Monica. Get over it. THE BOTTOM LINE HERE: SMPD is wasting money & effort by trying to make the participants of Critical Mass behave legally. By issuing tickets and forcing the group to obey traffic signals, it actually takes LONGER for the mass to move throughout the city- making the protest even more pronounced. If the SMPD would stop wasting time / money / effort, the protest would actually be out of your way sooner. Instead the SMPD is forcing the group to stop at stop lights and stop signs, which actually slows you down even more in your silly bus. If you are in a bus or car, it might or might not affect you 12 days out of the year for 10-15 minutes or so on each occasion. If that is really that big of a deal to you, you should help with the argument against the SMPD for starters. Once again- you cannot stop Critical Mass, no matter how much you like to bitch about it.

grendel20

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:59:11 -0800

Critical mass of functional retards.

johnbikes

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:59:09 -0800

The only time I've ever felt safe riding a bike in Santa Monica is with Santa Monica Critical Mass. The laws favor automobile usage, and make it extremely dangerous to ride a bicycle alone in this city with a population density as high as many parts of San Francisco where bike riding is more accepted. Santa Monica Critical Mass is a reaction to the lonliness, despair, and alienation of LA's car dominated culture. We ride together, we share together, we help each other out along the way. We don't toot horns at each other, we don't pollute the city, yell profanities at each other, we come in peace, we ride in peace.

Hindinwood

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:31:05 -0800

How do expect to gain awareness when the average person you are holding up on their way to work probably thinks it's a bunch of kids having a bike party? Do you stop to tell an immigrent who abrely speaks English and is trying to get to work on the 704 that you're holding up the bus because you are trying to raise awareness about biking??? PLEASE. Get a grip on reality. That's elitist.

katiepoche

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:23:09 -0800

... Also, Hindinwood, your assumption that there has been no recourse through planning and legal channels is false. Posting that we should just go through the glacially-paced city government (which we are doing) to gain awareness NOW about biking in LA is absurd and insulting. GET A BIKE, Hindinwood!

Hindinwood

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:22:34 -0800

^^^^ What's the statement, that someone should be late to work because they choose to ride the bus, and not a bike?? The only people Critial Mass make a statement to are themselves. I'm sorry to be so harsh, but that's my honest opinion. Once again I don't drive a car! I am with you on that! And I'm not talking about writing letters to LADOT ot Metro, I'm talking about going to meetings, talking to your councilman, getting involved, forming an advocacy group etc. In the 70's my parents were part of a group that brought rent control law to Santa Monica, and they didn't do it with street theatrics (although they are fun, I know), but with a hard working volunteer orginization that rallied the support of the community. THAT is how you get shit done.

katiepoche

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:18:54 -0800

Wow, the commenters on this article are woefully undereducated about biking and the law. Bikers do have the right to take the lane if there is no bike path. Bikers have the same rights and responsibilities as motorists on the road. Bikers are not a separate breed impeding traffic, they are human beings getting from one place to another on the road. Just like a person in a car. But taking up less space (meaning LESS congested car traffic, because we're going into smaller spaces in the road cars can't go) and emitting no fumes (meaning BETTER conditions for homeowners in the area) and, by the way, enjoying themselves why they do it (meaning FUN). Bikes are traffic. We're just better traffic. Try it sometime. Critical Mass is tonight.

ltlblugrl

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:13:03 -0800

Wow. It's amazing how much the car culture has really soaked into our feelings regarding transit in this city. Critical Mass makes a statement about cycling every time they ride - probably more than any letter-writing campaigns to Metro, LADOT.

Hindinwood

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:06:13 -0800

^^^^ Instead why don't these people work with LADOT and Metro, etc. to create more bike-friendly streets, and give a priority to creating more bike paths. This just seems like an ineffective way of contronting the problem that alienates potential allies and costs taz payers money which could be better used to...make more bike lanes!! In Santa Monica the city council etc. is pretty receptive to things like this that will make the city more "green", have less traffic, etc. Making some poor bud-rider (or car driver for that matter) late for work or school is counter-productive.

jrb

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:01:03 -0800

ven, bicycles really are a viable form of transportation. Around the turn of the last century, early 1900's, the bicycle was a far more popular means of personal transportation than the automobile. L.A.'s first freeway which started in Pasedena was actually a veloway that stretched for a mile and a half. It was built where the Arroyo Seco Freeway is now. Then came the car. And gasoline. And pollution. And now finally global warming. The whole point of Critical Mass is the take back the roads. They belonged to the bicycle long before they ever belonged to the automobile.

Hindinwood

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:51:20 -0800

Um....roads are designed for the use of cars and buses, not huge packs of bikes (they're not even designed that well for small numbers of bikes, but that's another issue). Whether or not you think it should be so doesn't change the fact that it is. As a disclaimer, I hate HATE cars. I don't even own one. But to claim that a huge group of bicycle riders has some kind of a legal right to completely take over the road and create a traffic hazard is simply untrue and really pretty self centered. What about those who ride buses and are simply trying to get to work or other appointments? Come on.

ven_nm

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:38:09 -0800

tell them to stop - they ride by my house and it is madness. why can't we all just use the bike path on the beach?

livyatan

Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:10:27 -0800

"Our problem is when they are in such massive numbers, they tend to take over the roadway which makes it dangers for everyone on the road." What a ridiculous statement. It's ok for cars to take over the road, cause traffic, and kill people everyday in LA. But as soon as a group of bikes takes over a whole lane, it's a danger for EVERYONE? Riders DO have a right to take over the whole road when they're in such large numbers. If auto drivers don't understand why, they should consider the fact that they take over the whole road EVERY DAY. What's the worst that could happen, bike traffic? Oh no, who would ever be able live in a city where traffic sometimes moves at 15 mph, that's unthinkable.