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"I looked to make sure. I wasn't being unsafe," Porcia London told the LA Times in a report about red-light enforcement cameras that questions if they are for revenue or safety. The issue at hand is that in Los Angeles, it is estimated that 80% of the photo-enforced tickets go to "california stop" right turns. "As London realized that day in court, her turn was illegal because she did not completely stop before turning." Well, duh...
... it is the right-turn infraction -- a frequently misunderstood and less pressing safety concern -- that drives tickets and revenue in the nation's second-biggest city and at least half a dozen others across the county.[...]
Motorists often are confused and complain about right-turn photo tickets, police say. John Jasso, a Pasadena technology manager, said he didn't fully get the complete-stop rule until two right-turn photo tickets came in the mail a week apart.
The danger with right hand turns on red lights is more for pedestrians than anything else, according to some officials cited in the article. And as a pedestrian, this writer could not agree more.
Here is the situation, often daily: you, as a pedestrian, approach an intersection at a stop sign or red light where you're about to cross. A driver approaches from your left wanting to make a right turn. They focus on not getting hit by cars coming from their left as they roll past the limit line, never making eye contact or noticing a pedestrian that has the right to cross to their right. They've now run the red light or stop sign, totally unaware that a pedestrian was there. Enough of a reason to enforce? Yes. The red light cameras should still enforce. Plan a city for people, not cars.
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That's how I got hit by a car. I was walking across the street when a car pulled up to the red light and instead of looking both ways he just looked left at the oncoming traffic. Then he went and ran right into me. Luckily, he wasn't going fast but I still fell onto his hood. I got up and then he gave me a hand wave as an apology and drove off. It was pretty amazing.
he gave me a hand wave as an apology and drove off
Indeed, this behavior amazes me too. It's as if somebody pulls a gun and shoots at you, but misses. "Oh, sorry about that. kthxbai"
I've almost been hit so many times in the scenario you describe. Wilshire/Westwood is a good place for that - a camera-controlled intersection.
Also, when you are already crossing the street, approaching and about to cross the right lane to reach the sidewalk, those who are making rights sometimes don't bother to stop before the crosswalk and that creates another dangerous scenario. In theory, they should be looking right at you but often they simply aren't.
As a group, many seem unapologetic and downright angry and hostile if you dare call attention to their actions. So to recap: you almost get struck by a careless, law-breaking driver, and then you get insulted or worse for daring to be bothered by it.
Welcome to LA.
Hey guys, how about this- you live in a city. Keep your eyes open as a driver OR pedestrian. If you find yourself almost getting hit by cars while walking down the street pretty often, put down the cellphone that you're texting on as you cross, and pull the headphones out of your ears.
Thank you radchilies.
Could not have said it better.
Great call radchilies...
At those same "Photo Enforced" intersections, I have seen on MANY occasions people running across the street against a red light. Whether its to catch a bus or to not break their stride/pace when they are jogging/running. The safety rules should go both ways...
WATCH WHERE THE @#$#@% YOU'RE DRIVING/WALKING!!!
good advice, radchilies, but next time let's not blame the pedestrians for the actions of a bad driver.
Yes, it's those damn pedestrians' fault the drivers are breaking the law!
I'll admit I've been guilty of this at the intersection of Wilshire and Westwood... The camera light went off, but no ticket came in the mail. This was months ago. Hopefully the traffic gods will forget about all of this...
While not as dangerous as the right turns into pedestrians, these lights really help those intersections have awful left turn timers.
Garfield and Firestone is (was) particularly problematic with all of the cars from the 710 ARCO trucks going into the refinery. Literally the light turns green for several seconds for you and there are still left turners going on red. They placed the cameras in the intersection over a year ago and it has severely cut down on this, thank goodness.
My wife was hit by a car last summer. Same idea. The car actually "almost" stopped at the STOP sign. She started to cross and he was looking the other way for oncoming cars and put his foot on the gas and went right into her. Luckily it was a short / sharp bump and he slammed on the breaks. She fell backwards towards me and I caught her.
I was furios and all he did was wave and say "SORRY" I said "why don't you effing look where you're going" and he said..."well I said sorry what more do you want" and he drove off.
AMAZING.
Keep ticketing and if one single life or serious injury is saved its worth it!!!
I like to wait in the right turn lanes until the light turns green with a line of cars honking behind me.
I'd say it goes both ways. After being guilty of not looking to the right before making the turn and almost hitting someone I know better than to roll through a red for a right turn. Knowing there are a lot of bad drivers out there that don't care or understand that rule I don't take for granted they see me as a pedestrian. As a pedestrian I don't assume the green light is my ticket to step into the street either. It all comes down to paying attention.
"'well I said sorry what more do you want' and he drove off."
While I sort of understand your anger, and don't blame you one bit, I am sort of curious about one thing:
What more did you want?
Did you want him to call the cops and turn himself in? To immediately hop out of his car, hand you the keys, and say, "Dear God, I am too stupid to drive. Take my car before I kill someone!" To chant "I will look at the crosswalk before driving it into" while beating his head against the pavement?
"What more did you want?"
Oh, I dunno. Maybe less of a flippant attitude?
I don't know about you guys, but if someone ran into my wife/gf and then gave me some cavalier wave, my fist would be through their window in a heartbeat. I'm not exactly a thug, but jesus man, there are limits.
Sometimes I think that they should just ban the right turn on red. I know, unthinkable. I would probably be complaining too. But it's like that in New York, and frankly, it's the only thing holding Manhattan back from utter chaos.
It's kinda like the cell phone ban. I strongly opposed it b/c I personally can handle talking on the phone in the car. But eventually, it became apparent that SOME people just can't do it. And those fucking morons piss me off a lot more than not being able to use a phone in the car. Sucks that retards ruin it for the rest of us, but better safe than sorry, eh?
as a pedestrian, I never cross without making eye contact with the driver.
Did you know pedestrians can get a ticket for starting to cross on a blinking light? They aren't there just to warn you to hurry up. The blinking lights are to give cars time to make a right turn. Busy intersections leave drivers stuck there forever between cars and pedestrians.
I promote the "pedestrian light" where all 4 crosswalks walk while cars wait, then pedestrians wait while the cars go. Most of them even have a diagonal crosswalk to make it easier for pedestrians.